A DLC free month to fix the bugs?

Just interested to know how many of you would prefer a month without DLC to fix the bugs?

I love TPA and want it to reach it's potential, kudos to Farsight for (IMO) making the best commercial pinball recreations, but there are a fair few bugs on many of the tables.

What do "The People" say?

Now that I have 10 tables, I could wait. Especially since I'm not happy with 4 of the 10 currently. As this point, who gives a damn about Twilight Zone if it comes out gimped. Imagine the furor FarSight will get when all the Kickstarters start demanding their money back because they put money into a broken table.

If their business model is to have monthly recurring revenue through the release of additional tables, it may make for sense to do one table a month for a few months. That way they still get revenue but can also fix the bugs.

Its not like if they stopped dlc that everyone in the company could concentrate on fixing bugs. They're not all coders ya know!

Putting this entire situation in perspective for myself, I would not mind if new tables were released every 2 months, up to this point on PS3 and VITA, we are not getting tables every month anyway, and with the 6 tables I already have, I have only concentrated on two of them ... The Black Hole and Bride of PinBot. Now this may very well be because I was never a pinball wizard in real life and never knew all the rules to any table I ever played in real life. So I have taken my time to learn all the rules for the Black Hole and started to learn them for BOP. Those who have been pinball players in real life all along probably know the rules to tables and when they are released they can jump right in ... they can also see some bugs a novice might not. But as a beginner, and someone who has fallen in love with video game pinball, not just TPA but also Zen, Marvel, and Pinballistic, I approach tables very slowly and in bits and pieces.

In addition, I have so many games for both my PS3 and VITA, that if I play games like pinball or billiards all the time .... games which essentially have no end to them, I will never finish any of my other games I have. So pinball and pool are usually played on the go on my Vita on train rides, buses, and ferries and usually when I am home I play games Crises 2, Renegade Ops, Warhammer 40K, and 3D Dot Game Heroes ... games that I can finish.

So in my eyes, I do not need a set of pin tables every month, I would much rather see a more polished product every other month. I also believe that Farsight should let some us on this forum Beta Test the talbes for them ... the testing phase need not be long ... I think a week of Beta Testing is all that is needed but how feasable that is with Sony is another question because in order to Beta Test a table, it would have to be on the Playstation Network.

stevesabol said:

If their business model is to have monthly recurring revenue through the release of additional tables, it may make for sense to do one table a month for a few months. That way they still get revenue but can also fix the bugs.

Click to expand...

I think selling two at a time makes more sense though since they can package an old and new table together, which means more revenue since some folks might be less likely to buy bothi f they were sold separately.

I don't mind if they take a month off - but they probably need the money coming in steadily from a business point of view.

The thing I think they should do (and have the resources here at this forum) is beta test early, so there is time to make fixes, on as many varied devices as possible. I'm always happy to help.

Yep, starting beta tests earlier is the key.

If that means the releases are delayed a little, then so be it. I think it would be worth it for everyone if it meant a more stable release.

But then there are also bugs in the earlier tables that haven't been fixed yet, so you have to think that they're just a bit too overworked at this point with all the various platforms. You can do more testing, but if the coders don't have time to read the bug reports and fix the bugs, then that's another problem...

They'll get it right eventually though. I think they're doing pretty well in sales, so maybe they'll be expanding their staff soon. Whatever the case may be, I trust they'll make the right decisions.

Anyone know which platforms they are doing beta on?
Also are they testing each release or is it random sample?

I don't think it is necessary. Every DLC that is released has had or will have improvements and bug fixes. Monster Bash/Gorgar came out a bit later in the month than prior DLC packs but it seems they used beta testing and more time in their studios to get the kinks out and it paid off. Just like in any profession, they are becoming more practiced, learning to do things differently for the best and ultimately the product is coming out in better shape right from the beginning. Plus it seems as though certain distractions are going away as they become more savvy in things that they may not have had much experience in doing such as license acquisitions, starting a kickstarter, product marketing, etc. Still a lot of work they need to do in these areas but they definitely will be more efficient in the future which will take them away less in the future from tasks related to bug fixes.

I'm going to go with take a month out, fix the damn bugs, get gamcenter released ( and working properly....I'm not holding my breath! ) and let the formats that are lagging behind with DLC catch up. Revenue shouldn't be a problem because of all the DLC thats backed up and the PS3 version not even being available yet in Europe.

With an older android device, I've started getting a sense of dread with every DLC release.
You sit there whilst it's downloading thinking "what's this going to break, and how long until it'll be fixed" or "will it even get fixed".

Dlc 2 busted all the tables (thread starvation issue - when Kindle fire was catered for), and if I hadn't had Titanium Backup I wouldn't have been able to play for 2 weeks till the fix was released.
Dlc 3 has bust Funhouse (one of my favourites) and introduced various degrees of lag into all tables (suspected - texture optimisation plan, which wasn't limited to Tegra only devices). (This has been reported and is being considered).

Don't get me wrong, I'm a Farsight Fan so will put up with pretty much anything, and Ryan (lead Android dev) is one the most communicative and helpful devs I've ever seen, but non "Fan-boys" are not going to put up with something they have paid fair money for, only working 3 weeks out of 5. And this is a business that to has to succeed to survive for us to play.

Farsight obviously aren't doing enough beta testing, early enough so changes can be made, on a wide enough variety of devices!

We've already had bug-fix releases between DLC rounds on iOS so I don't see an either-or situation here and as others have said we don't know their revenue model so it's not really worth thinking about. I am curious as to whether people are actually contacting support@pinballarcade.com with these issues and reporting them with the necessary level of detail - that is how they'll get addressed.

I think releasing tables is the best way to find the bugs. Besides, with more revenue Farsight can hire some more staff. Lastly, as already mentioned, not everyone at Farsight is a coder.

Part of the problem is the lack of response on the feedback. Bugs are "fine" as long as the reports about them get acknowledged and responded to. There are beta's going on but as you can read from several posts in this forum, the program is in a weird limbo as betatime is VERY short and the final releases being brought out differ from the final betarelease, introducing new bugs (like the MB multiball bug).

Keep bringing out new tables per month, but improve your QA cycle up front and your post-release communication after. Considering we now have an additional "Pinball Arcade" account commenting in the forums, I think they are already aware of the last one and there are things beign set up, although not visible to everyone, that the first is being set up more proper.

Better beta testing certainly. Many of us spot bugs and inaccuracies almost immediately when we begin playing the tables. Things like the CV and MB camera problems should have been flagged up very early on. I would have thought it all the more important to get everything right before submission (particularly on consoles) given the protracted approval cycle.

While I understand the need to get as much product on as many platforms as possible, they also need to develop a quality reputation. They should put in the time needed to get things right the first time, even if it means delaying the DLC.

I too would like to see this since I am really worried about how bugs will be handled on a system like the PSVita which is subject to what seems like more strict update rules. However, it does trouble me to wonder how issues like the lack of transparency on the miniplayfield on BoP makes it into the final release. When I first started the table it took no more than 3 seconds for me to ask, "What the hell is that big white square in the top right?". Also, the flipper issue on MM was discovered several weeks before the Vita release and acknowledged by the developers yet it still did not get fixed. I am not sure how Sony handles post release updates for Vita games, but I know that there is the possibility for them to be rolled out quickly since Resistance:BS got one on the second day (although that may just be an exception for a first party franchise). In addition to the problems with the new tables, the massive graphical downgrade seen on some of the original tables further detracts from the quality of the game. I just hope that there is some way these problems will be dealt with before the next DLC release.

While bugs are excusable, an update that makes the game look and play worse than before is not.

I am going to go impartial here on the merit of I don't know as much as they do in terms of their business model and financial situation. If finances weren't an issue I would say take one month and work out everything they can. However, they're essentially only doing 1.5 tables per month now since much of the groundwork is already laid out for the PHOF tables.

I for one applaud Farsight for having such ambition with this project. I don't know of too many developers who are putting out a product on so many different platforms. There IS going to be a learning curve and settling in period. Considering how small their employee overhead is, I just hope they don't get burnt out. The blessing/curse has been Facebook because you do get great exposure, but as we all know we get a LOT of whining and complaining. Bottom line: I am fine with whichever direction Farsight heads in because they haven't given me a reason to doubt them as a company.

FYI: I donated to the TZ project and am not worried that the table will be a bug-filled mess. There will be bugs when it's released. Consider how complicated the table is. Having guys on the forum like Ryan gives me peace of mind that the company is listening. That means a lot!