What is it about side-buttons that make pinball feel like pinball?

[HotHamBoy]

They're the same HAPP arcade buttons on any american arcade cabinet, but having them on the side makes all the difference. I've been trying all kinds of control inputs for playing digital pinball, from traditional gamepad shoulder buttons to keyboards to arcade sticks, and nothing really felt satisfying. Finally, I moddified one of my existing arcade stick controllers with goldleaf HAPP buttons on the side... Wow, what a difference! The illusion is so much stronger, but why should it really matter if the buttons are on the top or the side? It seems trivial, but it makes all the difference in my experience.

 

[shutyertrap]

Maybe because you can slap it? It's shaking a hand instead of giving a high five. Your wrists aren't bent but inline with your arm. It's an easier feel on your tendons when pushing the buttons. You can feel it by just making the motions in the air. I don't know, just a guess.

 

[HotHamBoy]

I do enjoy the slapping great job on the podcast, btw!

 

[jaredmorgs]

They're the same HAPP arcade buttons on any american arcade cabinet, but having them on the side makes all the difference. I've been trying all kinds of control inputs for playing digital pinball, from traditional gamepad shoulder buttons to keyboards to arcade sticks, and nothing really felt satisfying. Finally, I moddified one of my existing arcade stick controllers with goldleaf HAPP buttons on the side... Wow, what a difference! The illusion is so much stronger, but why should it really matter if the buttons are on the top or the side? It seems trivial, but it makes all the difference in my experience.

It boils down to two things: Ergonomics, and muscle memory.

 

[invitro]

I do enjoy the slapping

That's what she said!

 

[Slam23]

If you interact often with a machine, the brain incorporates it in our body scheme. It's the same with driving your car: no way people could drive (and park) safely if the car was not an extension of our body. Just see what happens when you borrow or get a new car, it feels strange and especially if it's a different size or your view through the windshield is different, you'll have problems in how confident you are in driving/parking. I guess it's the same way with pinball, you have a mental representation in how a pinball machine should feel and when buttons are placed elsewhere, it doesn't feel right. Offcourse there is also logic to ergonomic placement (you can't nudge easily if they are placed elsewhere), but if we would have learned how to play with buttons on top or front, having them on the side would feel strange. Just watch this excellent video in how our brain displays plasticity but also how hard it can be to unlearn automatic behaviour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFzDaBzBlL0 and this one about how easy our brain incorporates objects in our body scheme when presented with the right set of stimuli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEayC_fXGYY

 

[neglectoid]

your fingers are faster than your thumbs, unless you have ten thumbs... oh wait... mobile... nevamind

 

[Slam23]

your fingers are faster than your thumbs, unless you have ten thumbs... oh wait... mobile... nevamind

I had my share of moments in which I tried (or felt the urge) to nudge a real machine by pushing on the playfield glass....

 

[DA5ID]

Really interesting - i modded an icade with side buttons and immediately liked it because it simulated how you play a real machine - never thought about how much more comfortable it is!

 

[HotHamBoy]

Yup, modded my iCade for my iPad first, love it love love it. Zen on IOS doesn't support it so I modded one of my USB arcade sticks to play Pinball FX and TPA on my PC. I'm rockin a 22" monitor in portrait mode and it's so good.

BTW, anyone know how to get the iCade working with Zen via jailbreak? Blutrol stopped being updated pre-IOS 8. Allegedly IOS 9 will be jailbroken pretty soon, would love to use an app so I can play Zen with the iCade.

 

[DA5ID]

Yup, modded my iCade for my iPad first, love it love love it. Zen on IOS doesn't support it so I modded one of my USB arcade sticks to play Pinball FX and TPA on my PC. I'm rockin a 22" monitor in portrait mode and it's so good.

BTW, anyone know how to get the iCade working with Zen via jailbreak? Blutrol stopped being updated pre-IOS 8. Allegedly IOS 9 will be jailbroken pretty soon, would love to use an app so I can play Zen with the iCade.

I jail broke with blutrol at 7.0.4 using the icade mode. It actually doesn't work on any of my other pinball games (pure pinball, atomic, pinball collection,etc.) because if you hold one of the flippers you can't flip the other... Amazingly zen worked perfectly. I ran into an issue with pro pinball when it eventually did support icade natively - the blutrol still controlled it (with the broken flippers) even though I deleted the pro pinball profile from blutrol... The blutrol developers are unresponsive to say the least.

I wish icade would have released an official configurable control app instead of depending on developers to support the device. On the zen forums we have been asking for icade support forever and they are not biting.

 

[HotHamBoy]

I left a request on Zen's forum yesterday and Barbie's response was "thanks for the suggestion! *smiley*" i just don't understand why they don't bother. It can't be that hard, can it? TPA and Zaccaria are far less polished apps and they managed support, as did Pro Pinball and they only have one table. It's stupid.

 

[invitro]

(you can't nudge easily if they are placed elsewhere)

This is the only reason necessary... if anything it undersells the case. I don't know how you'd do even 5% of the nudging required for pinball to be actual pinball if the buttons were on the top rather than side.

I'm curious if any production machine ever had top buttons. I think the Irons & Woods prototype does.

 

[DA5ID]

If you interact often with a machine, the brain incorporates it in our body scheme. It's the same with driving your car: no way people could drive (and park) safely if the car was not an extension of our body. Just see what happens when you borrow or get a new car, it feels strange and especially if it's a different size or your view through the windshield is different, you'll have problems in how confident you are in driving/parking. I guess it's the same way with pinball, you have a mental representation in how a pinball machine should feel and when buttons are placed elsewhere, it doesn't feel right. Offcourse there is also logic to ergonomic placement (you can't nudge easily if they are placed elsewhere), but if we would have learned how to play with buttons on top or front, having them on the side would feel strange. Just watch this excellent video in how our brain displays plasticity but also how hard it can be to unlearn automatic behaviour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFzDaBzBlL0 and this one about how easy our brain incorporates objects in our body scheme when presented with the right set of stimuli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEayC_fXGYY

Great vids - your YouTube vid watching is classier than mine - I always end up in the weird parts of youtube...

 

[Slam23]

This is where I come in daytime....