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Flipper physics 3.0
- Thread starter mpad
- Start date
Lord Boron
Member
- Apr 18, 2012
- 583
- 1
I did a drop catch, but I have no idea how I did it. I just sort of happened.
It happens but I'm not sure it's natural... It feel a little forced like it shouldn't have but did - if that makes sense. Maybe a little tweaking - still way cool this has been added.
MadScience2006
New member
- Oct 5, 2012
- 779
- 0
I've done it about 10 times so far (iOS) but each time it happened, I certainly wasn't trying to do it...as Lord Boron stated above, it just sort of happened. It's strange to have it happen though and I wish I could actually do it while trying to do it. 
switch3flip
Member
- Jan 30, 2013
- 944
- 0
Yeah catching happens now and then without trying but with little practice and experience I'm starting to catch on purpose now and then as well. The sweet spot in timing is flipping just a microsecond early. Like you would backhand a rebound. Easiest catch is probably failed tube ramp shots that you "backhand" on return.
Improved tap passing I think actually came with jack*bot already, I found myself tap passing there all the time, maybe because I find myself in situations that need tap passing more often on that table.
Improved tap passing I think actually came with jack*bot already, I found myself tap passing there all the time, maybe because I find myself in situations that need tap passing more often on that table.
karl
New member
- May 10, 2012
- 1,809
- 0
Being able to do tricks is awesome. So far (after only a handful of tries) I have done a few live catches. Live catches = good work, Farsight
I am not bad at drop catches on real machines but I have not been very successful on those yet. Might just need to get used to how they work on the app. Drop catches = need more time to judge but cool to have the ability
Same with tap-passing. Need more time to check it out. Not easy on touch-based systems, but a gamepad should be easier. Looking forward to testing i out further.
The one thing that is most important to me, and I can not compliment this enough, is the much improved ball trajectory from aiming with the flippers. This is really noticeable from the end of the flipper shots. Nailing shots like orbits feels 1000 times more natural now. It is hard playing other tables after a session on Xenon. Gone are the Future pinball like inaccuracy.
The small disadvantage with the new physics is that alley passes have become much harder, but that is a small price to pay.
Farsight: Please. please, please implement the new physics to the other tables. This is like Christmas 10 times over. The new physics is b...dy marvelous. Only thing missing now is maybe a ball that feels a little heavier.
I can understand that updating physics for all the other tabels will take some time, since every table must be fine-tuned again (to not make them to easy) but it will be so worth it. Get to work
Grrrrreat work, Mike and team!!!
I am not bad at drop catches on real machines but I have not been very successful on those yet. Might just need to get used to how they work on the app. Drop catches = need more time to judge but cool to have the ability
Same with tap-passing. Need more time to check it out. Not easy on touch-based systems, but a gamepad should be easier. Looking forward to testing i out further.
The one thing that is most important to me, and I can not compliment this enough, is the much improved ball trajectory from aiming with the flippers. This is really noticeable from the end of the flipper shots. Nailing shots like orbits feels 1000 times more natural now. It is hard playing other tables after a session on Xenon. Gone are the Future pinball like inaccuracy.
The small disadvantage with the new physics is that alley passes have become much harder, but that is a small price to pay.
Farsight: Please. please, please implement the new physics to the other tables. This is like Christmas 10 times over. The new physics is b...dy marvelous. Only thing missing now is maybe a ball that feels a little heavier.
I can understand that updating physics for all the other tabels will take some time, since every table must be fine-tuned again (to not make them to easy) but it will be so worth it. Get to work
Grrrrreat work, Mike and team!!!
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- Feb 19, 2012
- 8,144
- 2
Great to hear, guys. I haven't got around to trying them yet, but now I really want to after reading your feedback.
mpad
New member
- Jan 26, 2014
- 1,398
- 0
- Thread starter
- #9
I can confirm this is definetly an improvement. Big thanks to the team at FS.
Played a two hour session with Xenon, while switching back to AFM a couple of times to compare. HUGE difference in Flipper timings! It take some practice but I can repeat the tap-passing almost every time and did some live catches, drop catches no luck yet (same like karl).
Haven't noticed a better aiming but I really didn't focus on that, will see if I experience an improvement here... Maybe FS could specify what exactly was improved, so we don't start seeing things that aren't actually there
This definetly should go into all the tables! maybe after some more feedback and finetuning, but nothing really speaks against it atm.
Played a two hour session with Xenon, while switching back to AFM a couple of times to compare. HUGE difference in Flipper timings! It take some practice but I can repeat the tap-passing almost every time and did some live catches, drop catches no luck yet (same like karl).
Haven't noticed a better aiming but I really didn't focus on that, will see if I experience an improvement here... Maybe FS could specify what exactly was improved, so we don't start seeing things that aren't actually there
This definetly should go into all the tables! maybe after some more feedback and finetuning, but nothing really speaks against it atm.
vikingerik
Active member
- Nov 6, 2013
- 1,205
- 0
It's an improvement, not a big one, but welcome.
It doesn't really feel like fluid physics, though. It's not really modeling the flipper acceleration and deceleration to do the catches. It just feels like a few more chunky if-then statements. Live catches in particular. When one happens, the ball just instantly glues itself to the flipper at zero velocity. There's no range of outcomes involving small bounces or anything, it's either on or off you did a perfect live catch or nothing happened.
Drop catches feel similar. There are a range of outcomes and bounces, but it feels like it's dependent only on the ball's incoming velocity, and not really on what the flipper is doing. Like the drop catch works the same way no matter where on the flipper stroke the ball hits. Also, drop catches aren't all that useful, since without ball spin, most times you could do a drop catch you can just make a simple hold catch or dead pass instead.
Tap passes have been around like that at least since Addams, I think. I've done them readily there all along. Again it's not real physics but a simplified recreation. Real tap passes are done by hitting the flipper button extremely quickly so it never even accelerates to full extension. TPA tap passes aren't based on the flipper swing, just happen automatically anytime the ball is near the tip of the flipper and going in the direction of the opposite inlane.
It doesn't really feel like fluid physics, though. It's not really modeling the flipper acceleration and deceleration to do the catches. It just feels like a few more chunky if-then statements. Live catches in particular. When one happens, the ball just instantly glues itself to the flipper at zero velocity. There's no range of outcomes involving small bounces or anything, it's either on or off you did a perfect live catch or nothing happened.
Drop catches feel similar. There are a range of outcomes and bounces, but it feels like it's dependent only on the ball's incoming velocity, and not really on what the flipper is doing. Like the drop catch works the same way no matter where on the flipper stroke the ball hits. Also, drop catches aren't all that useful, since without ball spin, most times you could do a drop catch you can just make a simple hold catch or dead pass instead.
Tap passes have been around like that at least since Addams, I think. I've done them readily there all along. Again it's not real physics but a simplified recreation. Real tap passes are done by hitting the flipper button extremely quickly so it never even accelerates to full extension. TPA tap passes aren't based on the flipper swing, just happen automatically anytime the ball is near the tip of the flipper and going in the direction of the opposite inlane.
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invitro
New member
- May 4, 2012
- 2,337
- 0
My opinion is that it's a useless gimmick. It doesn't have anything to do with real physics. I don't hate it, but I'd prefer that no more tables have 3.0, or at least that there be an option to choose.
Xenon does play more like a table of its era is supposed to play. I don't know how to separate that part (which is welcome) from the "trick-shot" part (which isn't).
Xenon does play more like a table of its era is supposed to play. I don't know how to separate that part (which is welcome) from the "trick-shot" part (which isn't).
Yeah, I'm gonna chime in here and say that I think this is a step in the right direction. It makes my play more like I do out in the wild.
It is very sticky around the tip, magneto type.
But other than the dead catch on the flipper I like the feel of it; and I am sure it will get better with some fine tuning!
It is very sticky around the tip, magneto type.
But other than the dead catch on the flipper I like the feel of it; and I am sure it will get better with some fine tuning!
SilverBalls
Active member
- Apr 12, 2012
- 1,233
- 3
Make the ball a little heavier and we are close to perfection
I agree a heavier ball and weaker flippers would be good. I managed to play a lot of Xenon today. Awesome table but I have managed to do more drop catches in a couple of hours than in my whole life on a real table. I think the flipper handling is better, but just need make the drop catches harder to get, so it is definitely nice work from Farsight and I am really liking the recent attention they are giving the PC build, so I hope it continues all the way to cab support.
Robert Misner
New member
- Oct 4, 2014
- 610
- 0
I'm not sure its possible but if the live catch was limited to the bottom 2/3s of the flipper from the hinge and not the 1/3rd at the tip..i think it would eliminate the weird ball stops at the end of the flipper and hovers effect.