Has TPA improved your real-life pinball game?

[HotHamBoy]

As someone who's state is pinball-anemic, I can tell you it absolutely has for me. I can learn the rules and layouts for tables, practice reaction times, experiment with risky shots. Everytime i return to a real-world location I feel that I've benefited from playing TPA in the interim. But I've only been playing pinball for a couple years. I will say, i really noticed it improving my game once I started using an arcade stick I modded with HAPP side-buttons for my PC. It really improves the simulation. I modded an iCade for my iPad too. Watching tournaments and guides for tables online is also really useful, especially when you can apply what you've learned to TPA.

 

[zmcvay]

Absolutely! Got started on Pinball in college 2(mumble..mumble) years ago, been moving between Hawai'i and Colorado since then with little convenient access to real machines, mostly just playing digital. Since I found TPA, it's given me an itch to hunt down more real tables and when I do I actually feel much more like I know what I'm doing. I got a chance to play a Black Knight and an Earthshaker last summer and the practice from TPA definitely carried over.

 

[HotHamBoy]

Oh yeah! It's always exciting to play a TPA table IRL for the first time. First you're like, "wow, it looks just like it!" Then you're like "sweet, I got this," and then you get your ego destroyed.

 

[sneakynotsneaky]

I'd say absolutely yes. WH2O is one of my favorites in TPA so when I had the chance to play the real thing I had it down. ST:TNG too. Not world-beating scores by any means but enough to feel good about it. But the most obvious one is PinBot. Played it a bunch before I ever heard of TPA and got crushed repeatedly. Afterwards, like night and day. For me it's a combination of actually knowing the rules and just actually learning better pinball techniques.

 

[neglectoid]

yes, im no longer affraid to dead flipper pass anylonger. this skill alone has improved my game vastly.

 

[Slam23]

Helpful:
- knowing the rules/layout
- knowing/avoiding dangerous shots
- basic/intermediate flipper moves like deadpass, cradle, postpass, slapsave

Not helpful:
- nudging: although you can learn to get a feel for when to nudge, to do it for real is another thing. I actually reached out to touch the playfield glass once to nudge on a real machine....
- the same succesful shots in TPA might not work on the real machine
- getting too used to the predictable physics in TPA will catch you offguard on the real machine
- advanced flipper moves are difficult or impossible to practice in TPA, like cradle separation, flipper passing, live and drop catching. With the recent improvements in TPA physics this has been better, but still not ideal
- overall effect: TPA mostly is vastly more easy than playing the real machine (there are some exceptions). You'll have to deal with killing it on TPA and then sucking on the real machine. Check your ego at the door...

 

[HotHamBoy]

I'd say absolutely yes. WH2O is one of my favorites in TPA so when I had the chance to play the real thing I had it down. ST:TNG too. Not world-beating scores by any means but enough to feel good about it. But the most obvious one is PinBot. Played it a bunch before I ever heard of TPA and got crushed repeatedly. Afterwards, like night and day. For me it's a combination of actually knowing the rules and just actually learning better pinball techniques.

WW and STTNG are two of my big favorites in both TPA an IRL too! Pinbot is my sworn enemy...
[MENTION=896]Slam23[/MENTION] all true

 

[PET3R]

Helpful:
- knowing the rules/layout
- knowing/avoiding dangerous shots
- basic/intermediate flipper moves like deadpass, cradle, postpass, slapsave

Not helpful:
- nudging: although you can learn to get a feel for when to nudge, to do it for real is another thing. I actually reached out to touch the playfield glass once to nudge on a real machine....
- the same succesful shots in TPA might not work on the real machine
- getting too used to the predictable physics in TPA will catch you offguard on the real machine
- advanced flipper moves are difficult or impossible to practice in TPA, like cradle separation, flipper passing, live and drop catching. With the recent improvements in TPA physics this has been better, but still not ideal
- overall effect: TPA mostly is vastly more easy than playing the real machine (there are some exceptions). You'll have to deal with killing it on TPA and then sucking on the real machine. Check your ego at the door...

It is not that difficult getting used to different physics but I think the biggest issue is the speed of the ball and the quick reaction needed. This is why I would not play TPA on PC or console as the ball seems to move slower compared to me playing on ipad mini. The low cam view makes it feel even slower and makes the shots much easier. You can easily see where the ball is going to land and therefore you have time to prepare for it. This is why I play TPA on ipad only in 2nd view or some tables 3rd view, as this seems to be the closest to realistic view, makes you feel that the ball is faster and it is harder to hit the shots. Thanks to this I train my reaction that is so much needed when the real table is approached. TPA would feel so much more realistic if they increased the speed of the ball slightly, and mainly when you use your flipper or when it hits the bumper.
Also when the ball is falling down it should be speeding up as it is pulled by gravity. Notice that in TPA it is falling with the same speed until it reaches the flipper, while IRL and unit3D the ball increases its speed as it approaches the bottom of the playfield.

Unit3D pinball seems to be much better in this. Compare these 3 videos to see what I am talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgBIWXOrJjk - unit3d pinball

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvz4Vw08cM8 - real life

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9Qb_2wq_qI - pinball arcade

 

[vikingerik]

Other way around. I've actually been worse at real pinball since TPA. For most of the reasons Slam23 says: gotten too used to the predictable railroad physics and easy nudging, and forgotten to do the subtle flipper moves that TPA doesn't allow. It takes me like an hour in a session to remember that real machines can do tap passes and drop catches and such.

 

[EldarOfSuburbia]

Probably hasn't helped a great deal, except in learning rules.

It still takes a while for me to get warmed up - when I go to shows typically my games at the end of the day are much better than they are at the start.

I just don't play real pinball enough to really tell though. 2 shows a year and a handful of visits to the movie theater isn't a big enough sample size.

 

[EccentricFlower]

I'll let you know, if I ever encounter a real pinball table in the wild ever again. They are exceedingly hard to find around here.

 

[WhiteChocolate]

i dunno; it didn't help me much upon encountering KISS the few weeks back... i don't think i scored an extra ball, though i was trying to shoot toward anything flashing. but it can take a good ten games to really kinda figure out where ya wanna go (if you don't read the rules, like i do!)

many more months back, when i went to tha union here and tried "family guy" and "stern trek," i had an easy time scoring up extra balls/games with them, puttin' in enough quarters for 3xgames off the bat... more so "fam guy" than "trek," but the staying power (the force? ;0) was there for me that day! i even left unplayed games on them for anyone next to come along.

i guess the two lawlors there at the time - monopoly and nascar - just weren't my day. hummmm... i really punched at "funhouse" back in the day there; i dunno what's different about those! layout and theme, i guess just weren't my thing... :\

definitely some different feel to the real ball, but there's no question that FS does better than zen in the "feel" of virtual pin... gotta say. just gotta build in someday those weird glass-bangs when the ball happens'ta bounce up off the table! (in fact, that's more what the "extra ball" slap sounds like in TPA! maybe that's what they chose to use instead of a genuine wood-slap...)

 

[HotHamBoy]

@White Chocolate to be sure, different tables of the same game can be more or less difficult. There are adjustments and tunings (both hardware and software) random variables (a lean, playfield scars, etc) and especially the condition in terms of rubbers, plunger, bumpers, etc. I like to go to a place in Laffyette, IN called Main Street Amusements. They have the largest collection of pins in Indiana (~30, which is about 26 more than anyone else). I do travel around Indy to play and I go to Chicago, etc. to visit barcades. Main St. Amusements has the hardest tables, on average, than any other place I've gone. Why? Because they are obsessively maintained. The owner is always performing upkeep, replacing rubbers, tuning, cleaning, etc. the result is that most machines play like new and this makes them much more difficult. The ball bounces at lightning speed, crawls towards outlanes without mercy. Catches are really hard.

I find that less-thoroughly maintained machines are a lot easier - most of the time. If a flipper is weak it can make some shots harder, especially some ramp shots, but it can also just simply make the ball travel slower. Any give at all when the the ball hits a raised flipper is going to deaden a lot of momentum. I played a Bally Game Show who's left flipper gave noticeable and it always cradled the ball without danger. If rubbers haven't been replaced in awhile the balls won't have as lively a bounce, making outlane posts less of a killer and making catches much easier. There are many variables in pinball, that's what makes it so appealing to me.

I guess what I'm saying is that KISS is going to be naturally more difficult than those other games because it's a really new table.

I really appreciate that the owner of MSA is so dedicated to preserving the game of pinball for us midwesterners, but it always crushes my ego when I pay a visit...

 

[Slam23]

Update: I played a lot of real tables this weekend at the DPO (Dutch Pinball Open). I even chose my tables in the individual tournament qualification based upon which tables I knew from TPA (HSII, Frankenstein, Funhouse, F14 Tomcat, Whitewater) and one new one (Demolition Man) I never played. Guess what: I sucked big-time on all TPA tables and got my best score on Demolition man! Although I went in knowing that the real tables would be playing differently and especially harder, I couldn't get my brain to adjust quick enough. To be fair, I had some edge because I knew the rules very well and a lot of stuff did work on both machines, real and virtual (hats off to TPA on that one). Aiming for particular shots based on my knowledge was not a good idea though, I would probably been better off to just try to keep the balls in play as I did with Demolition Man. Later on that day I played the international team tournament and I rocked the Party Zone. I guess I got used to playing the real machines and then my TPA knowledge gave me an edge for sure, because the other team didn't know the table that well. We finished 3rd behind Belgium and Germany, and had a real shot at place 2.
So the jury is still out on this topic for me...

And I'm with HotHamBoy on his latest post, I think this is very true. I have a very good maintained LOTR and that thing bounces like nobody's business. I also semi-regularly play a less maintained/older one at a friend, and that one is far more friendly. I think playing my LOTR is better for my skills, but still is more frustrating because I won't get far in the game.

 

[Locksley]

There is also an other consideration: knowing the rules but not having the skill.

In general I do allot better when I am just batting the ball around because if I make a plan it often backfires because I don't have the skill to carry it through.

When you are just reacting to the game it might just make you faster, and you are not trying to make shots that the particular machine you are playing is not as easy to make as on the one you trained on.

In general I would say that TPA has made me a better player, but I am not by any means as good as you need to be to enter a contest.