New tables/ atari catalog

[budtki@verizon.net]

o.k. TPA, everyday(just about), i log onto this web site to see if any new machines have been added to the up and coming list, it reminds me of those atari game catalogs that used to be included in the cartridge box of a new game, well, your catalog needs to be updated, what machines are on the horizon? give us something to get excited about, comet? highspeed? cyclone? fireball? paragon? simspons? grand prix?, speaking of grandprix, where is the middle of the field machines? we go from twighlightzone all the way back to as primitive as you can get, so what about machines like playboy, grandprix, or that machine with the curved flippers(timeWARP)...in any case is it possible to update your list so that your pinballFANS can get excited about more great machines?

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

They re-released those primitive tables as in they had them made already put a little spit shine on them and called it a day. In order to see something new they need the physical table.

 

[budtki@verizon.net]

skill shot, you totally missed the middle of the field point! when i said "primitive", i meant like BIG SHOT, and i was just making note that most of TPA's machines seem to be either post 1970 or pre 1960, not that that's a bad thing, a few older tables is a good change-up, but i think there are a lot of good 70ish tables that would be more enjoyable then playing more machines like BIG SHOT

They re-released those primitive tables as in they had them made already put a little spit shine on them and called it a day. In order to see something new they need the physical table.

 

[crazyflipperfingers]

budtki, I'm totally with you on wanting to see some more 70s late EM to early SS tables in the TPA lineup. They seem to get a lot of hate around here though. I'm not sure if that is because they are genuinely disliked by most people, or if the posters who love to cry and whine about every little problem with TPA are just the most vocal. I suspect the latter. I'm really excited for Central Park, Genie, and Centaur. I'm hoping we eventually get some tables like Mata Hari, Seawitch, Fathom, Meteor, Flash, Paragon, Centigrade 37, Joker Poker, Space Mission, Future Spa, Blackout, etc... I don't really understand the "newer tables only" mentality. I like them all and enjoy some variety.

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

I think you missed the part where they HAVE TO HAVE THE GAME FIRST. I was just pointing out the older tables your seeing them make they've already made before on previous collections these are the exception to having the physical table to digitize. Another thing to is FS has a limit to how many tables per company so they are focusing on tables in the top 100 and being counseled wich tables would be more popular. I wouldn't mind a fireball or games of that era but if I had to choose an EM over SS Im going to choose the newer tables.

 

[crazyflipperfingers]

I understand that they have to have a physical machine in order to digitize it. I would love to see the entire top 100 recreated as well, but they are quickly running out of non-licensed tables to do. Most of the machines I listed could be purchased for about a fourth of the cost of a more modern machine, and more importantly, there wouldn't be additional licensing costs associated with the table. I'm sure Farsight is trying to release the most popular tables that they can in order to get the most profit in return. That's cool and expected, but I'm just throwing a wish list out there I guess. Doesn't matter, I'll buy everything they release.

 

[DrainoBraino]

Why do they have to have a physical table for older games? VP designers are making great recreations without physical tables.

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

You know that? Theyre also done illegally.

 

[Kolchak357]

I'm really excited for Central Park, Genie, and Centaur. I'm hoping we eventually get some tables like Mata Hari, Seawitch, Fathom, Meteor, Flash, Paragon, Centigrade 37, Joker Poker, Space Mission, Future Spa, Blackout, etc... I don't really understand the "newer tables only" mentality. I like them all and enjoy some variety.

They are creating the most popular (highest ranked are usually DMD era) and the most historically significant (most of these are pre 1970) pinball machines. So the late 1970's and early 1980's machines have been underrepresented because of this. But I'm sure we will eventually see more from that time frame. They are some of my favorites too.

 

[crazyflipperfingers]

Why do they have to have a physical table for older games? VP designers are making great recreations without physical tables.

In order to do the tables "properly" they need to have a physical copy of the machine so they can disassemble it for measurements, scans, photos, etc... A lot of the VP tables look ok, but they are cobbled together with art from various (differing quality) sources and the measurements are guessed at based off of scans or photos. The ramps and other 3d elements are also approximated. What they end up with is sometimes really pretty decent but I don't think the quality is up to what we are seeing from Farsight.

 

[DrainoBraino]

You know that? Theyre also done illegally.

Yes I know both of those things.

But that's not the answer to the question: Why must they have a physical table to make a recreation?

In order to do the tables "properly" they need to have a physical copy of the machine so they can disassemble it for measurements, scans, photos, etc... A lot of the VP tables look ok, but they are cobbled together with art from various (differing quality) sources and the measurements are guessed at based off of scans or photos. The ramps and other 3d elements are also approximated. What they end up with is sometimes really pretty decent but I don't think the quality is up to what we are seeing from Farsight.

IMO many VP tables play and look just as good if not better than TPA. The physics especially are better. Some of the lighting mods are fantastic. This all done without a physical table.

Yet FS haven't done it "properly", even with the fact that they have a physical table and paid employees. There's still lack of rom emulation, obviously bugs, and art issues amung many other issues.

 

[crazyflipperfingers]

Yes I know both of those things.

But that's not the answer to the question: Why must they have a physical table to make a recreation?

Another important reason for having a physical table is for play testing to verify that the recreation plays as close as possible to the real thing. I've played a lot of VP tables that are nowhere close.

 

[DrainoBraino]

Ok sorry guys, I'm getting a little cranky here. I like TPA, and we all know the issues. I apologize for rehashing all that.

Back on track: Why couldn't FS make some of the older EM's and 70's and 80's tables without having the actual table?

 

[Sinistar]

Each table is digitally recreated from a actual table , that's how it's done . It ensures that the reproduction is mostly 100% accurate down to the minutia , as we have seen , this has not worked out that way , largely due to rush jobs and sloppy graphics optimisation and plain carelessness . But imagine if they did not use real tables for reference? , shudder