What Tables Does TPA Still Need Before It Can Truly Be Definitive?

CC13

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Sep 1, 2012
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TPA's been on a roll recently, with emulation quality improving and some fantastic choices for new tables (go, Centaur, go!). Still, we have a ways to go before FarSight can consider the work of preserving pinball done, but resources are tight and we may only be getting 3 more seasons, so doing all the tables, though it would be awesome, is probably not an option. What should FarSight's goals for TPA be? Here are some specific tables and broader goals I came up with:

- As many System 11 and WPC tables as can practically be done: There's a reason Williams is still the glamour brand among pinheads, even nearly 14 years after they left the business. With an array of 56 tables not yet emulated to choose from, this should provide at least another 2 years of release material, even accounting for licensing and other issues.

- At least 1 Gottlieb System 3 that doesn't feature Gunther the Gopher: OK, I'll admit that System 3 had a lot more clunkers in its lineup than the WPC MPUs did, but its best tables can go toe-to-toe with 95% of solid-state decks out there. Stargate is the premier (no pun intended) attraction here, but I've also heard from partisans for Class of 1812, Freddy, Lights, Camera, Action! and Street Fighter II. Opinions towards these tables seem to have softened with time, especially given the tanklike durability of System 3, so the time is right to give these underappreciated decks some love.

- At least 2 more Stern v1.0 tables: This is a corner of pinball history that doesn't get much love, so I'm really looking forward to the release of Table Pack #17. However, it would be a crying shame if Flight 2000 were the only Stern v1.0 to make it into TPA. I personally would go for Lightning first, Catacomb second and Nine Ball third, then take it from there (give Freefall & Iron Maiden some love, too, FarSight!), but I'd be happy with almost any 2 FarSight come up with here.

- Hyperball: This one seems to be something of a hate sink amongst pinheads, but bear with me for a moment. Everything I've seen of it so far looks fast, aggressive & unforgiving—classic Steve Ritchie, in other words. Also, if you're going to reject Hyperball for its lack of flippers, then you also have to reject any pinball machine released prior to Humpty Dumpty. Give Hyperball a shot and I'm sure you'll find it to be a grand old time!

- Smaller manufacturers: I know that FarSight are reticent about pursuing emulation of Alvin G., Atari & Capcom because it would be for the sake of perhaps 4 tables people want from each, but I still maintain that TPA is incomplete without those 2-4 tables from each of the aforementioned manufacturers. If it really would be that much of a hassle to do, how about separate apps for each manufacturer, much like A.S.K. Homework's Zaccaria Pinball app? You could charge a bit of a premium (to reflect the fact that these are a bit out of the way) and sell it mainly to the sorts of people who post at places like digitalpinballfans.com. Actually, I think that might be the best solution, since we want as many slots open for hwever many seasons remain as possible.

Does that about cover it or did I leave out something important?
 
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netizen

Guest
Given that list what about the realm of Bingo machines, and Panchinko, or other ball and spindle sort of bagatelle style games.

Just how far "should" FarSight go?

I stand by my Prediction that Hyperball and Miami Beach Bingo could quite possibly be the worst potential table pack combo ever for TPA, and there's very little that could be done to convince me otherwise.

In some ways I agree that Hyperball has all the elements you state, but I don't think that would translate over to digital, unless the whole VR system thing catches on. Part of the quirky charm of hyperball is the way it feels and how it sounds. Without the kinaesthetic elements it will just be "Bust-A-Move: Turbo!" :cool:
 

superballs

Active member
Apr 12, 2012
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I have a Street Fighter II at my bowling alley that I play occaisonally. Lights are out all over the place and the flippers seem a bit soft but overall plays ok i guess.
 

Jeff Strong

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Staff member
Feb 19, 2012
8,144
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I have a Street Fighter II at my bowling alley that I play occaisonally. Lights are out all over the place and the flippers seem a bit soft but overall plays ok i guess.

My bowling alley has one as well. It's alright, but nothing too special.
 

CC13

New member
Sep 1, 2012
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Given that list what about the realm of Bingo machines, and Panchinko, or other ball and spindle sort of bagatelle style games.

Just how far "should" FarSight go?

I stand by my Prediction that Hyperball and Miami Beach Bingo could quite possibly be the worst potential table pack combo ever for TPA, and there's very little that could be done to convince me otherwise.

In some ways I agree that Hyperball has all the elements you state, but I don't think that would translate over to digital, unless the whole VR system thing catches on. Part of the quirky charm of Hyperball is the way it feels and how it sounds. Without the kinesthetic elements it will just be "Bust-A-Move: Turbo!" :cool:

You may be right, but having the iPad vibrate could make up for at least some of that, as could making the controls be free-moving. That said, even the physical Hyperball seems to draw a lot of heat–it averages a 6.276 on Pinside and a 6.9 on IPDB. At the very least, Hyperball is a sign of things to come re: Steve Ritchie & cannons, so it should at least get some props for that. If pressed, though, I'd probably admit that Hyperball is the item from the initial post I care the least about.

I have a Street Fighter II at my bowling alley that I play occasionally. Lights are out all over the place and the flippers seem a bit soft but overall plays ok i guess.

My bowling alley has one as well. It's alright, but nothing too special.

I've actually been intrigued by the SFII pin for a while now. It looks fairly solid, but the rules seem a bit on the shallow side. Overall, I think it would make a solid third or fourth pin for a budding collection, but a horrible first and a merely passable second.

Orbitor 1

at the point they add that you know there's really nothin' left...

Oh, you!
 

shutyertrap

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Staff member
Mar 14, 2012
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Yes to bringing all the System 11 tables in. They are not only some of the most fun to play, but they are the first titles that tend to roll off people's tongues when recalling machines they used to play.

Even during the 70's, when pinball was in it's uncontested hayday, nobody could give 2 sh!ts about pinball without flippers. Yes, TPA is trying to preserve pinball history, but mix that in with how it was actually played when prevalent. Not interested in a history lesson, give me tables people actually wanted to play and play a lot.

To be the DEFINATIVE collection though, they need a certain Capcom title...Big Bang Bar. Then add in the other Capcom machines! Add in a Sega title and a Data East (yuck) for good measure. Finally, start securing some modern Stern machines and the other new makers. When FS stops making this game, it'll be a shame if there's nothing from the last 15 years.
 

sotie

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Aug 30, 2012
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Even during the 70's, when pinball was in it's uncontested hayday, nobody could give 2 sh!ts about pinball without flippers. Yes, TPA is trying to preserve pinball history, but mix that in with how it was actually played when prevalent. Not interested in a history lesson, give me tables people actually wanted to play and play a lot.

You have eloquently stated what I've been thinking for a while now. TPA is preserving pinball history but I believe it should be the "history" of which tables were actually played. Not the type of "history" preservation of a table with only 9 or 10 units produced (Goin' Nuts).

BTW, I'll probably enjoy playing Goin' Nuts just like all the other tables (except Dr. Dude) but I'm still against it because I feel there are other more worthwhile tables which deserve to be in TPA.
 

norbert26

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Apr 21, 2013
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bally's 8 ball deluxe i think it goes right along with Centaur (they were chained together in the game room) and got me really started in pinball. It would be a shame to not have it.
 

francis247uk

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Jul 7, 2012
480
1
Great thread topic. I do have a question though:
I've never heard Farsight say resources are tight and they may only do 3 more seasons. Has that been confirmed anywhere? I've only ever heard "for years to come" and that they wanted to do over 100.

Also Norbert they are probably doing 8 ball deluxe, the latest allgames podcast mentions it a lot
 
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sotie

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Aug 30, 2012
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Great thread topic. I do have a question though:
I've never heard Farsight say resources are tight and they may only do 3 more seasons. Has that been confirmed anywhere? I've only ever heard "for years to come" and that they wanted to do over 100.

Also Norbert they are probably doing 8 ball deluxe, the latest allgames podcast mentions it a lot

I either heard or read it in one of the various Bobby King interviews this past week. I don't recall him saying that resources are tight. I just remember he said they would do a couple of more seasons.
 

CC13

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Sep 1, 2012
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Yes to bringing all the System 11 tables in. They are not only some of the most fun to play, but they are the first titles that tend to roll off people's tongues when recalling machines they used to play.

I'm glad that doing all the Systems 11 decks has at least one vote of confidence! The only question is...which ones should we do first? I vote for Black Knight 2000, F-14 Tomcat, Banzai Run, Big Guns & Swords of Fury, in that order, for the next five System 11 tables. What's your System 11 request list look like?

You have eloquently stated what I've been thinking for a while now. TPA is preserving pinball history but I believe it should be the "history" of which tables were actually played. Not the type of "history" preservation of a table with only 9 or 10 units produced (Goin' Nuts).

BTW, I'll probably enjoy playing Goin' Nuts just like all the other tables (except Dr. Dude) but I'm still against it because I feel there are other more worthwhile tables which deserve to be in TPA.

I don't see any problem with the occasional curio such as Goin' Nuts in TPA. If it becomes overwhelming, then that is a problem, but seeing what might have been or what wasn't quite so overwhelmingly popular in its time has always fascinated me.

I either heard or read it in one of the various Bobby King interviews this past week. I don't recall him saying that resources are tight. I just remember he said they would do a couple of more seasons.

Well, of course resources are tight–FarSight don't have that many employees or that much money, or else they wouldn't need Kickstarters or prioritize cheap and fast in terms of the cheap-fast-good triple constraint (TPA has gotten noticeably better even since I started playing it, but getting tables out regularly at a low price is definitely prioritized over getting them out fully tested & bug-free). Also, I really do think that there are enough desirable pins out there for TPA to remain profitable well after the end of Season 5, so I don't know why FarSight would already be planning to cut off the flow of new tables by then. My guess is that they'll have TPA2 ready to go by that point at the absolute latest, but I've been wrong before.
 

sotie

New member
Aug 30, 2012
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I either heard or read it in one of the various Bobby King interviews this past week. I don't recall him saying that resources are tight. I just remember he said they would do a couple of more seasons.

Well, of course resources are tight–FarSight don't have that many employees or that much money, or else they wouldn't need Kickstarters or prioritize cheap and fast in terms of the cheap-fast-good triple constraint (TPA has gotten noticeably better even since I started playing it, but getting tables out regularly at a low price is definitely prioritized over getting them out fully tested & bug-free). Also, I really do think that there are enough desirable pins out there for TPA to remain profitable well after the end of Season 5, so I don't know why FarSight would already be planning to cut off the flow of new tables by then. My guess is that they'll have TPA2 ready to go by that point at the absolute latest, but I've been wrong before.

I read the original comment wrong... I thought he was saying that they're only doing a couple of more seasons because resources are tight. I was attempting to state that is not what I heard in the interview.
 

The loafer

Member
Oct 28, 2012
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Throw me under the bus if you wish but I would love something different, like a pitch n bat. As far as multiplayer goes, these can be a lot of fun and a good change of pace. Yeah, I know its not called "pitch n bat arcade". ;)
 

shutyertrap

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Staff member
Mar 14, 2012
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I'm glad that doing all the Systems 11 decks has at least one vote of confidence! The only question is...which ones should we do first? I vote for Black Knight 2000, F-14 Tomcat, Banzai Run, Big Guns & Swords of Fury, in that order, for the next five System 11 tables. What's your System 11 request list look like?

Sure, I'll play! Here they are, in the order I deem most important...

Rollergames
Earthshaker
High Speed
Banzai Run
F-14
 

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