When will the next Pinball Arcade table be released?

[Gorgias32]

This has probably been said before, but as a software developer and manager, the TPA product has had all the warning signs of a death march/dysfunctional project for years now. Serious showstopper bugs going for months without being fixed (and less serious but gameplay-affecting bugs NEVER getting fixed or addressed), wholly inadequate (and sometimes virtually nonexistent) testing on new releases, releases of new tables breaking older tables, features (like multiplayer) that were partially rolled out to the public and then abandoned. I would love to get the inside story some day, my guess is that there are a couple of "superheros" on the team that kept the releases coming and moving forward, and fought burnout.

 

[shutyertrap]

This has probably been said before, but as a software developer and manager, the TPA product has had all the warning signs of a death march/dysfunctional project for years now. Serious showstopper bugs going for months without being fixed (and less serious but gameplay-affecting bugs NEVER getting fixed or addressed), wholly inadequate (and sometimes virtually nonexistent) testing on new releases, releases of new tables breaking older tables, features (like multiplayer) that were partially rolled out to the public and then abandoned. I would love to get the inside story some day, my guess is that there are a couple of "superheros" on the team that kept the releases coming and moving forward, and fought burnout.

First time I visited FarSight, which was during season 1, everyone there was working on TPA. The 6 or 7 downstairs offices all had machines in them, there was a large room with machines in various stages of tear down, art department was all working on it, everyone, and Norman the sound engineer was clearly the most passionate. This has always been a small studio of 20 or so employees, and it was all hands on deck including management. The next time, maybe a year later, much the same. The last time I visited, a little less than a year ago, I saw 2 people working on something pinball related. Machines were no longer in most offices, the big room of tear down had not one machine in it, and Norman had retired. I think he was the heartbeat of TPA, he and Mike went to all the conventions, he did table purchases, and he would even call me up out of the blue just to talk pinball. There are still people at the studio who enjoy pinball, but I don’t think any have that obsessive passion. TPA was just part of the job, on to the next assignment.

 

[Crawley]

So much negativity.

When this came out in 2012 there were few digital pinball options, particularly recreating real-life tables, and at a high quality level - and yes back in 2012 the physics for TPA were pretty great. They put out 100 real-life tables, which is pretty incredible to have in one product. I know I put in 100's of hours playing this game and enjoying my time with it. And TPA inspired me to seek out pinball tables in real life. So I found shows in the area like Midwest Gaming Classic, Pinball Expo, and Vintage Flipper World which I would never have thought to look for before TPA. Now they're regular yearly stops.

The game also pretty much helped create this forum community, which I'm also thankful for. And there were plenty of fun threads related to the game created here, such as guessing the next monthly tables based on the newsletter hints.

So sure the game is rickety after 7 years and not up to snuff with the new hotness (Zen) and a lot of talked about features or bug fixes were never done. But it wasn't all bad by a long shot.

That said I am looking forward to Zen doing Sterns.

 

[1adam12]

So much negativity.

When this came out in 2012 there were few digital pinball options, particularly recreating real-life tables, and at a high quality level - and yes back in 2012 the physics for TPA were pretty great. They put out 100 real-life tables, which is pretty incredible to have in one product. I know I put in 100's of hours playing this game and enjoying my time with it. And TPA inspired me to seek out pinball tables in real life. So I found shows in the area like Midwest Gaming Classic, Pinball Expo, and Vintage Flipper World which I would never have thought to look for before TPA. Now they're regular yearly stops.

The game also pretty much helped create this forum community, which I'm also thankful for. And there were plenty of fun threads related to the game created here, such as guessing the next monthly tables based on the newsletter hints.

So sure the game is rickety after 7 years and not up to snuff with the new hotness (Zen) and a lot of talked about features or bug fixes were never done. But it wasn't all bad by a long shot.

That said I am looking forward to Zen doing Sterns.

Nice post, but you lost me at the end.

If I could actually play a Zen table with real life physics, maybe I'd warm up to it. Instead I'm stuck with the mobile hot mess trying to make me think it's pinball.

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[Gorgias32]

So much negativity.

When this came out in 2012 there were few digital pinball options, particularly recreating real-life tables, and at a high quality level - and yes back in 2012 the physics for TPA were pretty great. They put out 100 real-life tables, which is pretty incredible to have in one product. I know I put in 100's of hours playing this game and enjoying my time with it. And TPA inspired me to seek out pinball tables in real life. So I found shows in the area like Midwest Gaming Classic, Pinball Expo, and Vintage Flipper World which I would never have thought to look for before TPA. Now they're regular yearly stops.

The game also pretty much helped create this forum community, which I'm also thankful for. And there were plenty of fun threads related to the game created here, such as guessing the next monthly tables based on the newsletter hints.

So sure the game is rickety after 7 years and not up to snuff with the new hotness (Zen) and a lot of talked about features or bug fixes were never done. But it wasn't all bad by a long shot.

That said I am looking forward to Zen doing Sterns.

Yeah, my post about dysfunction was probably more negative than necessary. TPA, far more than Zen, pulled me into the world of pinball and has brought me way more enjoyment than any other game, and as you say TPA is the driver that created this community. The tables themselves are generally excellent, some are masterpieces, and I would say that all of them are worth the price. I am really just feeling disappointed that it had even more potential that was never realized, and that it feels like it's coming to an end.

 

[shutyertrap]

So sure the game is rickety after 7 years and not up to snuff with the new hotness (Zen) and a lot of talked about features or bug fixes were never done. But it wasn't all bad by a long shot.

You are 100% correct in what TPA gave and offered to many of us for many years. I think it's more disappointment in what could have been than just straight up negativity. The Zen releases are just shining a big ol' spotlight on that. And then there's the fact that people still want FarSight to pump out Gottlieb EM/SS machines, but they seemingly couldn't care to be bothered.

Nice post, but you lost me at the end.

If I could actually play a Zen table with real life physics, maybe I'd warm up to it. Instead I'm stuck with the mobile hot mess trying to make me think it's pinball.

The pinball is fine. You just can't see (or maybe even play) past the 'freemium' aspects that surround it.

 

[1adam12]

You are 100% correct in what TPA gave and offered to many of us for many years. I think it's more disappointment in what could have been than just straight up negativity. The Zen releases are just shining a big ol' spotlight on that. And then there's the fact that people still want FarSight to pump out Gottlieb EM/SS machines, but they seemingly couldn't care to be bothered.



The pinball is fine. You just can't see (or maybe even play) past the 'freemium' aspects that surround it.

The pinball is far from fine. Maybe I don't have enough tickets. Maybe there's some other issue. I really don't know.

What I do know is what I'm seeing are Zen physics but not pinball physics. Shots are predictable and far more accurate up ramps than they should be. The ball "dies" after coming off a pop bumper. It just loses momentum and heads down. No gradual loss of momentum, no gentle curve.

In a previous post, I said it felt more like a rock than a pinball. Maybe consoles are that much more superior. In TPAs case, while there was room for improvement and some shots definitely seemed more scripted, that's definitely changed.

I grew up in arcades playing real pinball. TPA brings the feeling back in a way Zen hasn't.

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[shutyertrap]

That's what I'm saying, you are stuck behind the freemium aspects. I play on mobile too, have all but one table completely upgraded at the moment. The Pro physics are brutal and fun. That being said, as I play on a phone, I tend to play using the Zen physics model instead as things are too small to react to in time with Pro. I've gone back and forth from TPA to Williams Pinball using the Zen physics, and I much prefer Zen. I get what you are saying about the heavy ball, it's been a constant complaint about Zen in general from many, I am not one of those, but I get it. I just feel like the ball is skating on ice in TPA, and that has everything to do with the fact there is no actual ball spin in the game, the ball has no friction on the play surface.

I challenge you with this...find a local place that has one of the 10 machines offered in Williams Pinball. Play the app, play TPA's version, and then play the real thing. I did just that recently, and there's simply no way you'll feel the same about TPA vs Zen after, even using Zen's base physics.

 

[1adam12]

That's what I'm saying, you are stuck behind the freemium aspects. I play on mobile too, have all but one table completely upgraded at the moment. The Pro physics are brutal and fun. That being said, as I play on a phone, I tend to play using the Zen physics model instead as things are too small to react to in time with Pro. I've gone back and forth from TPA to Williams Pinball using the Zen physics, and I much prefer Zen. I get what you are saying about the heavy ball, it's been a constant complaint about Zen in general from many, I am not one of those, but I get it. I just feel like the ball is skating on ice in TPA, and that has everything to do with the fact there is no actual ball spin in the game, the ball has no friction on the play surface.

I challenge you with this...find a local place that has one of the 10 machines offered in Williams Pinball. Play the app, play TPA's version, and then play the real thing. I did just that recently, and there's simply no way you'll feel the same about TPA vs Zen after, even using Zen's base physics.

That would be interesting to compare. I've always attributed the TPA play to tables that just didn't sit at much of an angle. Plus, there could have been some restriction in their contract with Williams. (just thinking out loud). With all of the criticism like what you're talking about, it seems like they would address it.

Personally, I always thought PRO mode on TPA should allow you to adjust the tilt of the play field.

TPA has still been performing tweaks to tables, so I'm hoping they at least have a Jack up their sleeve.

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[shutyertrap]

We used to grill FarSight about the tables not being difficult enough, that they were not designed for people to play one game for 45 minutes or longer, and that there really should be a difficulty adjust button. They teased for years that it was on the to-do list, but finally came out and said they didn't want to scare off the average player who just wanted to come in for a good time. We the hardcore would just have to take a backseat to the masses.

 

[1adam12]

We used to grill FarSight about the tables not being difficult enough, that they were not designed for people to play one game for 45 minutes or longer, and that there really should be a difficulty adjust button. They teased for years that it was on the to-do list, but finally came out and said they didn't want to scare off the average player who just wanted to come in for a good time. We the hardcore would just have to take a backseat to the masses.

By one game, do you mean one table, or one gaming session?

I'm happy with a few plays on a table. I've had ridiculously short games where nothing bounced my way, and amazing games where it all fell into place.

There's no way everyone will be happy. All of this discussion makes me feel bad for what the devs must have been dealing with. There was a lot of effort to pull off those 100 tables. I'm glad they did it.

I hope it's not over for them. If it is, it wasn't a bad run.

Side note: I feel that spreading themselves over so many platforms definitely hurt them. Instead of perfecting a few, they just did what they could across the board.

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[1adam12]

Just emailed them. Got this in response.

We are unable to make any announcements right now. We are planning on releasing new content in the future. If you haven't already, please tune in to our weekly Twitch stream for updates and announcements.

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[trash80]

Side note: I feel that spreading themselves over so many platforms definitely hurt them. Instead of perfecting a few, they just did what they could across the board.

This is an excellent point. I believe they got up to something like 14 different storefronts and platforms supported over the life of TPA. I understand that their business model relied on the one customer, repeat purchase model, but at some point it does get to be ridiculous, which I think maybe the Kindle and Ouya versions may have been where that line was crossed.

Plus, on the Steam side when they released the DX11 version it showcased just how many people were playing TPA on potato-grade systems, and it seems that Farsight was destined to support an aging platform base whether they wanted to or not.

 

[Citizen]

I'm still waiting for TPA to release on Tandy-3000.

 

[trash80]

Just emailed them. Got this in response.

We are unable to make any announcements right now. We are planning on releasing new content in the future. If you haven't already, please tune in to our weekly Twitch stream for updates and announcements.

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So they have gone from "new tables," to "new content." I'm not sure what to think about that.

 

[trash80]

I'm still waiting for TPA to release on Tandy-3000.

I'm somewhat surprised it never featured on one those fitness trackers or the Samsung smart fridge.

 

[shutyertrap]

By one game, do you mean one table, or one gaming session?

I mean sitting down to play Ripley's, and 45 minutes later still on that same game start, just 9 extra balls later. There's a few people who documented scores that took over 8 hours to achieve. The pinball ROMs were simply not meant to handle this much data, and often the game would bug out due to the ROM failing, not TPA itself. Nobody at Williams ever thought for one moment that people would roll the score on certain DMD machines. Essentially the Donkey Kong kill screen was reached.

In TPA I had no problem scoring a minimum of 2 billion on Creature, every single time I played. I'd then go play a real machine and not even get one multiball started to attempt the most basic of jackpot scores. I could complete 2 wizard cycles on Twilight Zone, but if I got 170 million on a machine in the wild, I'd be stoked. I find my scores with Zen match my real world prowess much more.

 

[1adam12]

So they have gone from "new tables," to "new content." I'm not sure what to think about that.

Good catch! If I had old commodore 64 I'd boot it up and look for tables.

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[shutyertrap]

There's a certain code to the way FarSight speaks that once you know, it becomes amusing. They'll say things like "yes we can", "we're looking into that", "we'd love to do that", "it's possible", and "things are in the works". None of it of course is committal.

 

[wilbers]

Bit like https://www.lotro.com/en/content/brief-history-time-according-sapience and all the variations of "soon".