When will the next Pinball Arcade table be released?

[Kolchak357]

I thought we were in for another dish from the Olive Garden then.

If only we could be that lucky.

 

[Pete]

i'd be happy with an old half eaten taco from a dumpster behind walmart 50 miles away from anywhere that even sells tacos lol

 

[Jake_Ry4n]

When is the official funeral?

 

[Kolchak357]

When is the official funeral?

It was a long time ago in a galaxy far far away

 

[Rayder]

There was no funeral, there was just life support, then they pulled the plug.

 

[gnadenlos]

lucky we have Zen , no need to say anymore !!!

Zen hasn't proved that they are willing to releases tables with 3rd party licenses. Where are tables like Indiana Jones, Adams Family, Terminator 2, Star Trek TNG, Scared Stiff, Twilight Zone, The Shadow, Dracula, Judge Dredd, Indianapolis 500, Congo, Doctor Who, Who Dunnit, Demolition Man, The Flintstones and NBA Fastbreak?

Maybe not all of them are possible, but even Farsight managed to get licenses for some of them.

Alphanumeric tables are missing completely on FX3. At least highlights like FunHouse, The Machine: Bride of Pinbot, Taxi, Elvira and the Party Monsters, Whirlwind, Black Knight 2000, Earthshaker, Diner and High Speed would be great.

Even some Digital tables are good enough to bring them to FX3, like Centaur (II), Black Knight and Space Shuttle.

All those tables are fan favorites. Without those tables FX3 feels very incomplete and we will have to stick to other solutions like Pinball Arcade and VPX (VR).

VR is also missing. Farsight has Stern Pinball VR with ~10 tables at least.

So at the moment I don't see that Zen is the real savior of digital pinball. They only released all the easy/uncomplicated DMD tables until now. And I'm not sure if they really want to release the other tables, because it would have been easier to sell some (alpha)numeric tables in a bundle with DMD tables - they missed that chance.

If they get Stern/Sega/Data East licenses it's even less likely they'll try to obtain some of those 3rd party licences or give us (alpha)numeric tables.

 

[1adam12]

Zen hasn't proved that they are willing to releases tables with 3rd party licenses. Where are tables like Indiana Jones, Adams Family, Terminator 2, Star Trek TNG, Scared Stiff, Twilight Zone, The Shadow, Dracula, Judge Dredd, Indianapolis 500, Congo, Doctor Who, Who Dunnit, Demolition Man, The Flintstones and NBA Fastbreak?

Maybe not all of them are possible, but even Farsight managed to get licenses for some of them.

Alphanumeric tables are missing completely on FX3. At least highlights like FunHouse, The Machine: Bride of Pinbot, Taxi, Elvira and the Party Monsters, Whirlwind, Black Knight 2000, Earthshaker, Diner and High Speed would be great.

Even some Digital tables are good enough to bring them to FX3, like Centaur (II), Black Knight and Space Shuttle.

All those tables are fan favorites. Without those tables FX3 feels very incomplete and we will have to stick to other solutions like Pinball Arcade and VPX (VR).

VR is also missing. Farsight has Stern Pinball VR with ~10 tables at least.

So at the moment I don't see that Zen is the real savior of digital pinball. They only released all the easy/uncomplicated DMD tables until now. And I'm not sure if they really want to release the other tables, because it would have been easier to sell some (alpha)numeric tables in a bundle with DMD tables - they missed that chance.

If they get Stern/Sega/Data East licenses it's even less likely they'll try to obtain some of those 3rd party licences or give us (alpha)numeric tables.

I have to agree with you on this. After a regular release schedule, it seems to have slowed to a crawl.

I appreciate that TPA used to tease their tables so you could guess at the next release.

Zen hasn't said anything, have they? Which was the last batch released? I'm genuinely forgetful. Was it the monster pack, or was there one after that?

As someone that still plays tpa on my iPad, it's interesting that they still have contests. It may only be a couple of people there, but they're doing their best to keep a pulse going, even if it is weak.


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[Citizen]

Zen hasn't proved that they are willing to releases tables with 3rd party licenses.

Creature from the Black Lagoon, Monster Bash.

 

[wilbers]

I have to agree with you on this. After a regular release schedule, it seems to have slowed to a crawl.

I appreciate that TPA used to tease their tables so you could guess at the next release.

Zen hasn't said anything, have they? Which was the last batch released? I'm genuinely forgetful. Was it the monster pack, or was there one after that?

As someone that still plays tpa on my iPad, it's interesting that they still have contests. It may only be a couple of people there, but they're doing their best to keep a pulse going, even if it is weak.


Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk

There was a release in December after the Universal Monsters pack, it seems likely that the next release from Zen will be by end of March (no idea which tables will be in it).

I wasn't playing pinball when Farsight was releasing new tables (other than the last 2 Stern's they released), but seems monthly table releases was too frequent, rather than the release it when its ready that Zen does. If Farsight had done the same then I'd presume many of the long standing bugs and errors would have been fixed in beta/before release.

 

[1adam12]

As someone else pointed out, a big part of what did them in was trying to be all things to all people. I think there was an issue with the Xbox version of their game, and squashing bugs across so many platforms definitely leaves more room for more bugs.
How many ways did farsight take their eye off the ball?

The stern stand alone app.
The reskins, like Ghostbusters over Haunted House
The horrible update that ruined the menu and contest score keeping on mobile.

I loved what they did and the passion in which they did it. I hate that instead of shifting gears they seem to have completely given up.

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[Pete]

i know some people have it worse depending what console, but to me the pc version of TPA never seemed all that messed up. you could definilty list small stuff thats wrong but in the end it all works pretty decent. im happy they rushed the monthly releases, if they took twice as long we would of only got half the stuff. quality aside, zen will never release as many bally/williams tables as TPA, i wouldnt count on them even doing more than 10 non-dmd tables. espeshially if they do get stern, they will just finish whatever dmd tables they can get and move along to stern never to look back.

 

[Crawley]

Right. That's how I viewed it as well with the PC release. Didn't really have a problem with it and the complaints to me seemed pretty minor to my enjoyment of the game.

 

[gnadenlos]

Farsight gets too much hate lately. It's really impressive what they achieved IMO.

They missed very few of the best Willams/Bally DMD tables:

They also did the complete Top 10 of alphanumeric tables (and some more):

And 10 of the best numeric tables:

If you look at that maybe they didn't lose the licence by accident - there wasn't much left to do for them to earn new money with that license.

 

[dave950lam]

They didn't lose the license by 'accident'. There were doins afoot.

 

[shutyertrap]

Zen hasn't proved that they are willing to releases tables with 3rd party licenses. Where are tables like Indiana Jones, Adams Family, Terminator 2, Star Trek TNG, Scared Stiff, Twilight Zone, The Shadow, Dracula, Judge Dredd, Indianapolis 500, Congo, Doctor Who, Who Dunnit, Demolition Man, The Flintstones and NBA Fastbreak?

Zen is just getting started. In that first season of tables, FarSight only released 2 licensed tables, Twilight Zone and Star Trek, and it happened at the tail end of a year's worth of releases. So Zen is right on track there. On top of that, FarSight had to crowd source funding which Zen is vehemently against. You are questioning the first year of releases and comparing it to 7 years worth from FarSight.

Maybe not all of them are possible, but even Farsight managed to get licenses for some of them.

You doubt Zen's ability to license? Who couldn't FarSight get to even take a phone call, and who is Zen working hand in hand with? Oh yeah, Marvel, and LucasFilm. They not only secured licensing with Universal, they've created 6 original tables for them. They've licensed with Fox (who is now Disney), Bethesda, Valve, and more. I think their track record speaks volumes.

Alphanumeric tables are missing completely on FX3. At least highlights like FunHouse, The Machine: Bride of Pinbot, Taxi, Elvira and the Party Monsters, Whirlwind, Black Knight 2000, Earthshaker, Diner and High Speed would be great.

You have to remember, taking on the Williams license was a big risk to Zen, considering they didn't know how well it would be received by both the TPA audience who already owned the tables, and the Zen audience that loves their fantasy pinball. They purposely started out with DMD era because 1) that was what was most popular with the TPA crowd and 2) was most similar in nature to what the Zen crowd had already been playing. Alphanumerics are on the way, trust me. Zen is also having to contend with those that want "something new" while not ignoring the popular stuff people want better versions of. We did a whole piece on just that in our BlahCade podcast from 2 or 3 episodes ago.

Even some Digital tables are good enough to bring them to FX3, like Centaur (II), Black Knight and Space Shuttle.

All those tables are fan favorites. Without those tables FX3 feels very incomplete and we will have to stick to other solutions like Pinball Arcade and VPX (VR).

Again, give it some time. They put out 18 DMD tables in one year. They are not stopping at that for table count. It's like complaining that The Witcher has barely touched on any of the stories from the books while Game of Thrones covered all theirs and went beyond. When Zen has put out 7 years worth of content, feel free to make all the comparisons you want.

VR is also missing. Farsight has Stern Pinball VR with ~10 tables at least.

How many Williams tables did FarSight put out in VR? Zero? So we're on even ground with that. Zen does have VR tables available with some originals. Will they make any more? Good question. Is the VR user base that plays pinball large enough to justify the costs?

So at the moment I don't see that Zen is the real savior of digital pinball. They only released all the easy/uncomplicated DMD tables until now. And I'm not sure if they really want to release the other tables, because it would have been easier to sell some (alpha)numeric tables in a bundle with DMD tables - they missed that chance.

They didn't come in looking to be the 'savior', but they've certainly improved on each and every table in spades. I don't understand how you can say the 18 tables they've recreated are easy or uncomplicated. I mean in what way? Licensing? Rules? Toys? Such a subjective opinion to throw out there. Of course they want to release more tables, and now that the Zen crowd has grown to like 'real world tables', selling alphanumerics will actually be easier. They've already convinced the TPA crowd, so it's win win. On top of that, they are adamant about securing 3rd party IP licenses and releasing those tables too. Zen knows a thing or two about marketing which is how they've managed to build their studio to have 40-50 people who just work on pinball, and about that same number working on all their other titles non pinball related.

If they get Stern/Sega/Data East licenses it's even less likely they'll try to obtain some of those 3rd party licences or give us (alpha)numeric tables.

If they get the Stern license, they will probably revamp the engine once more and it'll release as FX4. You gotta believe that's at least 2 years down the line, so plenty of time to prove themselves capable with Williams machines that have licensing. They also know there is no point in getting Stern without also being able to obtain licensing, something I think FarSight wildly miscalculated on.

 

[shutyertrap]

I have to agree with you on this. After a regular release schedule, it seems to have slowed to a crawl.

I appreciate that TPA used to tease their tables so you could guess at the next release.

Zen hasn't said anything, have they? Which was the last batch released? I'm genuinely forgetful. Was it the monster pack, or was there one after that?

As someone that still plays tpa on my iPad, it's interesting that they still have contests. It may only be a couple of people there, but they're doing their best to keep a pulse going, even if it is weak.


Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk

Zen doesn't over promise by speaking about anything until it is actually about to happen. There were plenty of things promised to us by FarSight that never came to fruition, which was the source of a lot of frustration then to many customers. Speaking of which, how's that new mystery pinball title FarSight promised would be 'coming soon' in their streaming vids going? Uh huh, yep.

And is FarSight really doing their best to keep a pulse going? Doing their best would be continuing to fix bugs on various systems, fixing the atrocious menu system of Stern Pinball Arcade, continuing to tweak and adjust tables. And news flash, they weren't doing this when the game was healthy.

 

[1adam12]

Your statement assumes a lot of things. For them to do everything you mentioned, they would need a decent size team. I suspect there are just a few warm bodies there for whatever reason.

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[Pete]

maybe FS they just read all the crap talk on here and decided you know, screw us guys, were just a bunch of ungrateful jerks. I bet they return out of nowhere just to put out one of those old school just plunge it with no flippers 1950's tables just to laugh at us. ...and oh wow i love those graph charts nice man!

 

[gnadenlos]

FarSight only released 2 licensed tables, Twilight Zone and Star Trek

You forgot about Adams Family, two Elvira tables, Bram Stoker's Dracula, Judge Dredd, Terminator 2, Indianapolis 500, Doctor Who, Monster Bash, Creature from the Black Lagoon?

On top of that, FarSight had to crowd source funding which Zen is vehemently against.

How does this help us getting as many tables as possible? I would gladly pay extra to get Indiana Jones, Twilight Zone, Addams Family, Star Trek TNG, The Shadow, Terminator 2, Indi 500, Demolition Man, Flintstones, NBA Fastbreak, etc. in Pinball FX. We don't have any alternatives as long as Zen has the Willams/Bally license and Pinball is a niche market, so they should do whatever is needed to bring us those important tables.

You doubt Zen's ability to license? Who couldn't FarSight get to even take a phone call, and who is Zen working hand in hand with? Oh yeah, Marvel, and LucasFilm. They not only secured licensing with Universal, they've created 6 original tables for them. They've licensed with Fox (who is now Disney), Bethesda, Valve, and more. I think their track record speaks volumes.

I doubt they'll bring us as many tables with 3rd party licenses as FarSight until they start doing 2-3 of the "bigger" ones.

You have to remember, taking on the Williams license was a big risk to Zen

Releasing alphanumeric tables is a risk too, now that they can't bundle them with popular DMD tables, that don't require additional licenses. They missed the chance to include those tables in the first 5 packs. IMO they should have stretched those packs from 5 to 7 packs and include the most import alphanumeric tables without much risk.

They purposely started out with DMD era because 1) that was what was most popular with the TPA crowd

Yes, they started with popular DMD tables that didn't need extra licences. That's what I meant when I said "easy tables". There are (almost) none left and releases and announcements stopped - that's why I'm worried about the future. Every future release will be more risky, expensive and/or complicated. They have "wasted" all bullets and will have to use the knife for the rest of the game. I'm asking myself why they did that, if they really want to give us a big selection of Willams/Bally tables. Maybe they only wanted to release the popular and uncomplicated tables before they drop the license in a few months.

Again, give it some time. They put out 18 DMD tables in one year. They are not stopping at that for table count. It's like complaining that The Witcher has barely touched on any of the stories from the books while Game of Thrones covered all theirs and went beyond. When Zen has put out 7 years worth of content, feel free to make all the comparisons you want.

I give them all the time they need, but I will only believe they will do as many tables as Farsight, if they really start to do alphanumeric tables and a few of the big licenses.

Is the VR user base that plays pinball large enough to justify the costs?

They just have to modify the engine. We don't need fancy animation like they did in FX2 VR, but they need to do it before they lose the Willams/Bally licence.

I don't understand how you can say the 18 tables they've recreated are easy or uncomplicated. I mean in what way? Licensing?

Yes licencing. AFAIK only two tables needed extra licencing and even those were the easy ones, that didn't need Kickstarter campaigns in the past. Give us Indiana Jones, Adams Family, Terminator 2 and Star Trek without Kickstarter and I will be impressed.

 

[trash80]

You forgot about...
...Yes licencing. AFAIK only two tables needed extra licencing and even those were the easy ones, that didn't need Kickstarter campaigns in the past.

You clearly misread shutyertraps post.

Even the "unlicensed" tables require various third party license agreements, many of which are difficult to secure due to the byzantine nature of legacy rights ownership.