Zen Pinball FX3 Williams Pinball Volume One

[wolfson]

I wonder if Zen should release the tables in 2 versions: Arcade (easier Shots) and Simulation. Then there should be 2 different leaderboards and (almost) everybody should be Happy.

blindpeser , that`s a great idea ,even if they had a few more levels . like I said before Forza & Horizon have about 6 different levels . to me they have to cater to the starter in pinball , the good player , the really good player & the extremely good player. not everyone is at one level , I`m at the 2nd level ,a good player!!!

 

[dmil666]

I'm not nearly good enough to abuse the current beta of fish tales. I always feel like i have the chance to, but i just can't seem to manage it. its' definitely still harder then TPA.

Same here. You start to get going, your timing is on and the shots are happening, then you lose a little control and it snowballs until you lose it down the sides. So close, so you go back and go at it again.
And again. And again....

 

[Jeff Strong]

The outlanes feel more generous to me than you’d expect to see on the real pin (they were more brutal in the first private beta). Most of the time I don’t even bother nudging when the ball is over there because it bounces back towards the middle on its own around 80% of the time when it should be closer to a 50/50

 

[dmil666]

The outlanes feel more generous to me than you’d expect to see on the real pin (they were more brutal in the first private beta). Most of the time I don’t even bother nudging when the ball is over there because it bounces back towards the middle on its own around 80% of the time when it should be closer to a 50/50

Sounds to me like bragging...

 

[wolfson]

Sounds to me like bragging...

dmil666 , you got the wrong guy , Jeff never braggs full stop !!!

 

[Jeff Strong]

Sounds to me like bragging...

lol not even close. First of all, I’m talking about an aspect of the Zen physics that have nothing to do with skill since I’m not nudging to save the ball from the outlanes and I’m talking about the natural tendencies of the ball, and secondly, I’ll be the first to admit that I’m not a good player (doesn’t help that i’m blind in one eye, half blind in the other, and have no depth perception heh). That hasn’t stopped me from playing though, and I’ve been playing pinball as long as I can remember, even if I’m mediocre at best.

However, I do want the game to be as realistic as possible because I love the adrenaline rush that comes from the chaotic battle to control the ball, and when that is diminished, it stops feeling like pinball and I stop playing.

So it has nothing to do with my skill level, but I do have a fairly good idea of how real physics work and feel, having grown up with a pinball machine in my living room as a kid (sorry if that sounds like bragging, not my intent lol as we were quite poor, but my dad was lucky enough to make a trade on an old pin back in the 80’s), and I just like getting my arse kicked by a pinball machine, what can I say? If a game lasts more than 5-10 minute for a player like me, then more work needs to be done on the physics!

And I’m totally cool with them making the “arcade” setting a bit easier (within reason, mainly with post and ROM settings), but they shouldn’t hold back on the “tournament” setting at all.

[MENTION=2636]wolfson[/MENTION] thank you, my friend

 

[wolfson]

Jeff I`m hopeless as they come at pinball , and like you I just love playing . Zen do listen , I`m quite positive they will do different levels , because of the leaderboards , I think the best would be 3 levels ,easy ,hard & extreme . I think we have to cater for everyone , the youngsters and the new players , the middle of the road players like me paddling up ships creek without a paddle , and the really good players . I hope that Zen can cover everyone . I`d say they might have better ideas , I keep stressing give Zen as much feedback as you can . every ones voice counts even if we differ in opinions !!!

 

[dmil666]

lol not even close. First of all, I’m talking about an aspect of the Zen physics that have nothing to do with skill since I’m not nudging to save the ball from the outlanes and I’m talking about the natural tendencies of the ball, and secondly, I’ll be the first to admit that I’m not a good player (doesn’t help that i’m blind in one eye, half blind in the other, and have no depth perception heh). That hasn’t stopped me from playing though, and I’ve been playing pinball as long as I can remember, even if I’m mediocre at best.

However, I do want the game to be as realistic as possible because I love the adrenaline rush that comes from the chaotic battle to control the ball, and when that is diminished, it stops feeling like pinball and I stop playing.

So it has nothing to do with my skill level, but I do have a fairly good idea of how real physics work and feel, having grown up with a pinball machine in my living room as a kid (sorry if that sounds like bragging, not my intent lol as we were quite poor, but my dad was lucky enough to make a trade on an old pin), and I just like getting my arse kicked by a pinball machine, what can I say? If a game lasts more than 5-10 minute for a player like me, then more work needs to be done on the physics!

And I’m totally cool with them making the “arcade” setting a bit easier (within reason, mainly with post and ROM settings), but they shouldn’t hold back on the “tournament” setting at all.

[MENTION=2636]wolfson[/MENTION] thank you, my friend

Yeah, I'm right there with you on wanting the game to be as realistic as possible, otherwise there's not a whole lot of point to the emulation for people who like to play pinball and can't have a real machine at home (much less 100 machines - yikes!), or are trying to set up a cabinet.
But you know, some days you go to play, and it's like the pin has its evil setting stuck on "high", and it's a real struggle to just keep a ball in play. The outlanes seem to be 6 inches wide and they're in cahoots with the bumpers, and if you do manage to get a flipper on the ball, it just ricochets around off of every non-scoring surface and drains...lather, rinse, repeat.
I've been having a bunch of days like that lately so I might be a little cranky.

You had a pin in your living room as a kid? OOoooooo....

 

[wolfson]

dmil666 , pinball is about fun . you can always start another game . sometimes you got to laugh at your self , I laugh at myself every time I play hahaha !!!

 

[kimkom]

Hi folks,

Haven't posted for a loooong time but I have frequented the forum now and again to see what's occurring.

I guess I became disheartened by the lack of progress on TPA.

Even though Farsight were still releasing tables, the quality just wasn't there anymore and not much was being done about it. It was as though it became a pointless exercise to report an issue because I knew nothing would be done to fix it. I still fire TPA up on occasion but it doesn't take long before I start seeing things that haven't been addressed since launch. I guess the passion just died and every time I fire TPA back up it seems to die a little more. Sad.

Anyway, now I'm super stoked for what Zen are doing with the Williams beta!!

Quite simply, it's incredible! I've not been this excited for ANY game for a very long time and that's all down to the quality of work Zen are applying to the Williams tables. It's obvious these guys have the same passion that we all do, and they have the technical knowledge to make our dreams a reality. Not only that but they are listening to our feedback and applying it in-game, now.

To me, it's clear that Zen have a clear vision for the Bally / Williams license and want to make PFX3 the best platform in which to experience these great tables. Lets face it, these classic tables deserve to be treated with the respect that Zen are already giving them in the beta.

I can't wait to see where Zen takes this, and I for one am pleased to be back here posting about it!

Zen, the good times are back! Thank you.

 

[AndyD]

Small world Andy I’m down the road at Castletown and currently rebuilding my vpin after the disillusionment of TPA and their promise of cab mode followed by the Arcooda fiasco. I scrapped my cab around 4mth ago but kept the 3 screens and accompaniments.
Now that I have tasted the beauty of Zen in full screen it’s back to the drawing board for me and a mate from Biddick Woods with a couple of 4K vpin winter projects planned.
Should you wish to tryout how good a decent vpin feels you are more than welcome to experience mine and I also own 3 full sized real pins TZ, FH and JY.
A mate across the street from me also owns several full sized pins he keeps in his garage and rarely plays so there are probs more in our neighbourhood than the whole of Sunderland/Newcastle combined lol
I am also a PS4/switch owner but after experiencing the glory of a PC in vertical mode if you are a pinaholic like me who knows you may even consider one for yourself after a shot on mine.
Regards Colin

Hi Colin, an even smaller world, im only in Rickleton washington. Im sure i'll have to take you up on that offer, especially since your so close!? Im not very pc savvy though so when people talk of these virtual pin cabinet things im intrigued. Be good to have a look though. Oh and Junk Yard is one of my mrs favourites too so i'll probably "drag" her along too if thats ok....

Cheers.

 

[AndyD]

PS4 and consoles won't get demo tables due to the cost of submissions and lead times according to an interview I heard with Mel.

Zen is keenly aware of our brand of hard core here, and they know they have to nail it with us if they want to get a high adoption rate. The problem is many people haven't touched a real table in years and are basing physics judgment off either memory or worse, what they are able to pull off in TPA. It's a lot we are asking of their physics engine, to be able to pull off flipper tricks, but these very tricks are not easy to pull off in real life. Even backhanding can be tricky on a real table. So yes, these things should be doable, but they should also require the skill needed to pull them off. I don't have to think about doing a post pass in digital pinball, but on a real table it's amazing how often I mistime it and send the ball in all manner of places I didn't intend.

The most important aspect with getting it right this first time is that it will become the benchmark they use to set all other tables. So I encourage everyone, go find a real table, any table, make that trek if one is not convenient, and then try doing some tricks, see what a dead pass feels like, how high the ball bounces, how much a ball moves when nudging it on the flipper, etc. Then come back and give notes.

Absolutely, im sure it will end up being a balancing act. All things considered it already seems like its going in the right direction. A reasonable improvement in the physics im sure will be enough for most people to get on board. Whether it can be fully replicated is another matter....

 

[Hinph]

Hi folks,

Haven't posted for a loooong time but I have frequented the forum now and again to see what's occurring.

I guess I became disheartened by the lack of progress on TPA.

Even though Farsight were still releasing tables, the quality just wasn't there anymore and not much was being done about it. It was as though it became a pointless exercise to report an issue because I knew nothing would be done to fix it. I still fire TPA up on occasion but it doesn't take long before I start seeing things that haven't been addressed since launch. I guess the passion just died and every time I fire TPA back up it seems to die a little more. Sad.

Anyway, now I'm super stoked for what Zen are doing with the Williams beta!!

Quite simply, it's incredible! I've not been this excited for ANY game for a very long time and that's all down to the quality of work Zen are applying to the Williams tables. It's obvious these guys have the same passion that we all do, and they have the technical knowledge to make our dreams a reality. Not only that but they are listening to our feedback and applying it in-game, now.

To me, it's clear that Zen have a clear vision for the Bally / Williams license and want to make PFX3 the best platform in which to experience these great tables. Lets face it, these classic tables deserve to be treated with the respect that Zen are already giving them in the beta.

I can't wait to see where Zen takes this, and I for one am pleased to be back here posting about it!

Zen, the good times are back! Thank you.

You've captured exactly how I feel. Once it became clear that Farsight was never going back and fixing all the things we hated about the tables, I just lost my enthusiasm and stopped playing/buying... Zen has brought it back. We can actually see them watching enthusiast YouTube videos, engaging with the community, and making actual adjustments based on feedback rather than "maybe thinking about possibly looking into it if we weren't so busy making all of these new tables with new issues that will never be addressed." I wish the best for Farsight, but they really drained the ball on the TPA project. I blame the management and not the developers.

 

[wilbers]

You've captured exactly how I feel. Once it became clear that Farsight was never going back and fixing all the things we hated about the tables, I just lost my enthusiasm and stopped playing/buying... Zen has brought it back. We can actually see them watching enthusiast YouTube videos, engaging with the community, and making actual adjustments based on feedback rather than "maybe thinking about possibly looking into it if we weren't so busy making all of these new tables with new issues that will never be addressed." I wish the best for Farsight, but they really drained the ball on the TPA project. I blame the management and not the developers.

I've only (re-)discovered digital pinball this summer, but with what I've read since then I certainly agree with that. Kusn Jimmy (a dev.) has been posting on Steam and clearly knows some of what needs to be done, but implementing it (or not) seems to be a management decision. Feel quite sorry for him - its not his fault he's hampered.

 

[kimkom]

You've captured exactly how I feel. Once it became clear that Farsight was never going back and fixing all the things we hated about the tables, I just lost my enthusiasm and stopped playing/buying... Zen has brought it back. We can actually see them watching enthusiast YouTube videos, engaging with the community, and making actual adjustments based on feedback rather than "maybe thinking about possibly looking into it if we weren't so busy making all of these new tables with new issues that will never be addressed." I wish the best for Farsight, but they really drained the ball on the TPA project. I blame the management and not the developers.

Nice one Hinph.

Let the good times roll!

 

[Pinballfan69]

Still really impressed with the quality of Zen's product. Now after playing the Beta for the Williams table, It's clear that this will be the better product. I've actually gone into TPA and played FT and Medieval Madness. Haven't play TPA in a while as I've mentioned I've gravitated toward Zen's tables more often and have been enjoying them more than TPA tables.

I digress. After playing TPA's renditions of the beta tables, I must say, that the ball was really floaty and slow IMO. It was just as easy to go through the middle ramps/loops as it was in ZEN though the ball didn't wiz by as fast again IMO. The nudging is more responsive and considereing it's easy to do the death save in ZEN there's no way to do it TPA.

As far as the weight of the ball in ZEN I still think it's on the heavy side. a little more bounce possibly but I'm no expert on what's right or not but that's my opinion.

 

[dmil666]

dmil666 , pinball is about fun . you can always start another game . sometimes you got to laugh at your self , I laugh at myself every time I play hahaha !!!

Sorry if I came across too serious, I was meaning to poke fun at myself and how it seems like the tables "have it in for you" sometimes. I laugh at myself every time I play too.
Thanks for your concern .

 

[Jeff Strong]

Yeah, I'm right there with you on wanting the game to be as realistic as possible, otherwise there's not a whole lot of point to the emulation for people who like to play pinball and can't have a real machine at home (much less 100 machines - yikes!), or are trying to set up a cabinet.
But you know, some days you go to play, and it's like the pin has its evil setting stuck on "high", and it's a real struggle to just keep a ball in play. The outlanes seem to be 6 inches wide and they're in cahoots with the bumpers, and if you do manage to get a flipper on the ball, it just ricochets around off of every non-scoring surface and drains...lather, rinse, repeat.
I've been having a bunch of days like that lately so I might be a little cranky.

You had a pin in your living room as a kid? OOoooooo....

Right on man. And yes I was pretty lucky in that regard.

Hi folks,

Haven't posted for a loooong time but I have frequented the forum now and again to see what's occurring.

I guess I became disheartened by the lack of progress on TPA.

Even though Farsight were still releasing tables, the quality just wasn't there anymore and not much was being done about it. It was as though it became a pointless exercise to report an issue because I knew nothing would be done to fix it. I still fire TPA up on occasion but it doesn't take long before I start seeing things that haven't been addressed since launch. I guess the passion just died and every time I fire TPA back up it seems to die a little more. Sad.

Anyway, now I'm super stoked for what Zen are doing with the Williams beta!!

Quite simply, it's incredible! I've not been this excited for ANY game for a very long time and that's all down to the quality of work Zen are applying to the Williams tables. It's obvious these guys have the same passion that we all do, and they have the technical knowledge to make our dreams a reality. Not only that but they are listening to our feedback and applying it in-game, now.

To me, it's clear that Zen have a clear vision for the Bally / Williams license and want to make PFX3 the best platform in which to experience these great tables. Lets face it, these classic tables deserve to be treated with the respect that Zen are already giving them in the beta.

I can't wait to see where Zen takes this, and I for one am pleased to be back here posting about it!

Zen, the good times are back! Thank you.

Welcome back!

 

[wolfson]

Sorry if I came across too serious, I was meaning to poke fun at myself and how it seems like the tables "have it in for you" sometimes. I laugh at myself every time I play too.
Thanks for your concern .

no worries

 

[Colywobbles]

Hi Colin, an even smaller world, im only in Rickleton washington. Im sure i'll have to take you up on that offer, especially since your so close!? Im not very pc savvy though so when people talk of these virtual pin cabinet things im intrigued. Be good to have a look though. Oh and Junk Yard is one of my mrs favourites too so i'll probably "drag" her along too if thats ok....

Cheers.

JY is currently the only table not set up as it’s currently at a mates house “biddick woods” and it’s probs gonna end up sold by Xmas to pay for my vpin upgrades needed (4K and new video card) hopefully all this will be done in the coming weeks
I’ve always coffee on the go and kinda semi retired so give me a pm if ya wanna pop down with the missus some time if only to experience how Virtual Pinball should really be played.