New physic`s 3.0

[MagnumXL]

your describing a drop catch there buddy

Ok, I had the terms mixed up (live catch being the reverse of a drop catch, but more angle dependent; I never really tried to do these "live catches" in real life (I did drop catches all the time, which are far easier to do, IMO), thus, I must be "accidentally" getting live catches all the time since I see it happen multiple times per game without even trying. That doesn't happen in real life remotely that often. Meanwhile, I have yet to get it to drop catch once and I've tried a few times now (no trouble in the real world with the ball at the right angle).

My issue with it happening too often is that these tables are already way WAY too easy compared to the real world counterparts (save the new F-14, which must be the first table I've played in TPA that has an actual real world slope setting on it). The problem is slope by far. Most real world tables had slopes akin to 6-9 degrees to make them difficult. But while difficult, it also made them FAST and fast + more difficult = feels like the real world games. I'm getting to the wizard modes on games like TZ every single time without even trying.... It's not fun to be THAT easy. A TZ game shouldn't last an hour without even trying. The other problem is way too many extra balls. I'd rather see replays/credits be the normal style of playing just because extra balls extend games that would never get extended in the real world.

How about a "Home" vs. "Arcade" setting? Keep the current games for the "Home" setting and use higher slopes and less extra balls for the arcade settings. That would make TPA 10x more fun for people like me that played these games to death in the real world and want a little bit of a challenge. Yes, I could play Theatre of Magic all day long on one credit in the real world, but I'm not THAT good on most other tables. I can get to wizard modes, but not on my first try. I have to warm up and get in the groove and even then, I wasn't even close to championship guys that go to PAPA etc. (and it's not hard for me to go to PAPA since it's only about an hour away for me).

 

[vikingerik]

I see no correlation between Pinball Arcade's "live catching" and real life. It almost seems to happen randomly in TPA. In real life, you HAVE to drop (let go of button) the flipper at nearly the exact moment the ball hits the flipper. I see NO SUCH THING happen in TPA.

That's a drop catch not a live catch. But you're right about how TPA handles both types. I'm sure that TPA isn't really simulating the fine physical details. The right way is to model the flipper weight and acceleration and the effect of the ball's weight on the flipper, even details like how far the ball sinks into the flipper rubber. Simulate the details of how the flipper absorbs the ball's momentum. Then maybe the ball's momentum happens to come out to nearly zero and you can get a catch, or maybe it wasn't quite zero and the ball is still doing something else. I don't think TPA is doing any of that at all. It's just a crude check that if you flipped or dropped at the right time, deliberately set the ball's velocity to zero.

Notice you never get a near-miss on a drop or live catch in TPA. You never see the ball almost stop but bounce just a little bit or drift off the tip of the flipper. This happens all the time on real machines, a near-perfect catch is much more common than an absolutely perfect one. But never in TPA, where the catch is either absolutely perfect or doesn't happen at all.

 

[mpad]

^ totally agree

 

[Robert Misner]

I think what would help to improve the drop catches to behave more realisticly would be to implement some ball spin and flipper deflection when it gets hit hard .

 

[EccentricFlower]

I guess it's the new physics that make certain tables feel like their flippers got a lot weaker? Not all, but some. The one I particularly notice is Cactus Canyon where shots to the upper center of the table seem to have gotten a lot harder to make. On several tables I now notice I don't have enough velocity to get up ramps unless I flip at exactly the right time. On the other hand, some tables have become *easier* - the ramps in Twilight Zone and Theatre of Magic are now easier for me. Is this just me hallucinating again, or could the physics changes affect this?

 

[vikingerik]

TZ and TOM's ramps were always easy. You just got better at shooting them.

And I don't feel any difference on Cactus Canyon. If you do, it's probably because you're trying to shoot the Polly ramp more often and Bart or Gold Mine less. TPA's flippers have always been weak up the middle, most noticeably worst on Medieval Madness and Junkyard, but any dead-center shot like Polly or MB's Mosh Pit often can't be hit with a moving ball.

 

[Markus]

Please adjust the new Flipper Physics to less sensitivity! Because it happens very often that you do an unwanted "life catch" while you are trying to shoot the ball with a powerful volley.

Just tried on T2 again. Even when you hit a moving ball, flippers now feel much more weaker than before.
I think skillful and powerful volley shots are important for pinball gameplay and I hope that this can be corrected.

 

[p6800]

So we have Flip Trap - http://www.ipdb.org/playing/wizard.html#FlipTrap

When will we also see Drop Stop in TPA? - http://www.ipdb.org/playing/wizard.html#DropStop

 

[EldarOfSuburbia]

So we have Flip Trap - http://www.ipdb.org/playing/wizard.html#FlipTrap

When will we also see Drop Stop in TPA? - http://www.ipdb.org/playing/wizard.html#DropStop

It's already in there. Try it on the Mystery Rider kickout on HD3. Somewhat pointless in the context of the game, but good for practice! It is actually implemented better... looks and feels more "natural".

 

[p6800]

I have yet to see a drop stop, yet flip traps i pull oof every 30 seconds.

 

[MagnumXL]

I have yet to see a drop stop, yet flip traps i pull oof every 30 seconds.

Same here and it's the opposite for me in real life (i.e. I can drop catch easily; I don't live catch all the time) so the tables feel odd since I'm live catching constantly without trying at all. I'd rather have the feature turned off or not exist than be implemented so poorly, but that's just me.