PBA : Free Camera Mod

[Robert Misner]

I love both games and I'd love love love a custom camera for PBFX2 as well..

 

[priested]

Come ... join the Dark Side ...

Already with you. I own all TPA tables and regularly play on both PC and iOS. in fact, I play TPA far far more than I ever played Zen.

 

[SickBoy]

Not sure about anyone else, but my primary excitement for this is that I could position the table in portrait mode so that I can see the backglass at the same time, letting me hide the floating UI and experience the game as realistically as possible. It'd still be nothing compared to cab-style support, but it's better than nothing.

If any of the beta testers want to show a screenshot of that kind of camera angle, I wouldn't say no ;P

Question for the testers/dev: how does this impact forced views? Such as forced backglass zoom-in views on tables like Cyclone? Does it (hopefully) ignore those triggers and just keep the view as-is? In that same vein, does it keep the camera how you want it when plunging a ball? My hope for this is that you pick an angle and it doesn't change regardless of what the default game does.

 

[JPelter]

Not sure about anyone else, but my primary excitement for this is that I could position the table in portrait mode so that I can see the backglass at the same time, letting me hide the floating UI and experience the game as realistically as possible. It'd still be nothing compared to cab-style support, but it's better than nothing.

If any of the beta testers want to show a screenshot of that kind of camera angle, I wouldn't say no ;P

Question for the testers/dev: how does this impact forced views? Such as forced backglass zoom-in views on tables like Cyclone? Does it (hopefully) ignore those triggers and just keep the view as-is? In that same vein, does it keep the camera how you want it when plunging a ball? My hope for this is that you pick an angle and it doesn't change regardless of what the default game does.

Sadly there's no way that would work unless you're working with a 50 inch monitor with some absurd resolution. The angle between playfield and backglass means you'd have to zoom out so far you wouldn't be able to make out the playfield. Probably wouldn't even be able to see the ball very well. Either that or it'd be angled so low you wouldn't be able to make it work. Then again I don't understand how people play with the low camera angles even as it is, so maybe that would work for someone.

 

[SickBoy]

I've already done the photoshop estimating to figure out the angle for my favorite tables, not to mention plenty of tables already go *almost* into that mode when the game is over or when it's doing the automated flyby... and my version would be more fine-tuned, so it's a guaranteed win on my end. It works just fine for my needs, though I realize others may not like it. I am perfectly fine with how it looks in theory, and overall I'd prefer that angle to landscape any day

Also, keep in mind a lot of tables don't have much on the upper half of the backglass, so you can slice out that part with the angled camera. A steeper view of the backglass is also not much of an issue with reading the scores/DMD/etc., so that makes it possible to have a better angle on the table.

Really my planned mode of play isn't all that different from the standard view... it's just a few tweaks to get the score/DMD in sight, and fine-tuning the whole thing to maximize view and angle of the table.

This all may sound silly or impossible (or totally incomprehensible... I've had a few beers), but once the application is released I'll share screenshots and settings if anyone else is interested. I own all the tables and I'll be adjusting custom views for each until they're perfect (to my standards, at least).

 

[SilverBalls]

Not sure about anyone else, but my primary excitement for this is that I could position the table in portrait mode so that I can see the backglass at the same time, letting me hide the floating UI and experience the game as realistically as possible. It'd still be nothing compared to cab-style support, but it's better than nothing.

If any of the beta testers want to show a screenshot of that kind of camera angle, I wouldn't say no ;P

Question for the testers/dev: how does this impact forced views? Such as forced backglass zoom-in views on tables like Cyclone? Does it (hopefully) ignore those triggers and just keep the view as-is? In that same vein, does it keep the camera how you want it when plunging a ball? My hope for this is that you pick an angle and it doesn't change regardless of what the default game does.

I can't create a screenshot now as I am away from home for about a month, however it should be possible to get a view like that as the camera is completely free roaming. What you describe is like the newish Hybrid view created by Rascal over at VPUniverse which you might know aready.

Visual Pinball Hybrid View

http://vpuniverse.com/forums/files/...al-shiva-rascal-shadowsclassic-itchigo-10-hv/


With NoEx's mod the camera is locked permanently when plunging and when table events happen. The only time the table camera moves is at the end of the game, when the game does a fly-by around the table. As soon as you click start, the mod locks the camera to your chosen view for the whole game. The only downside of losing the 'event cameras' is for games using the backglass such as 'Lights, Camera, Action' but there are only a small number of tables like that. With the Hybrid view you won't have that issue of course.

 

[kinggo]

Can't say that I'm interested in this since I don't play on PC but I'm glad for all of you guys that do play on PC. I would like to see something like that for android.
But it's been two weeks now and not a single comment on this from FS. Can't say that I'm surprised.... Is it so difficult to express some general thoughts about this?

 

[SickBoy]

With NoEx's mod the camera is locked permanently when plunging and when table events happen. The only time the table camera moves is at the end of the game, when the game does a fly-by around the table. As soon as you click start, the mod locks the camera to your chosen view for the whole game. The only downside of losing the 'event cameras' is for games using the backglass such as 'Lights, Camera, Action' but there are only a small number of tables like that. With the Hybrid view you won't have that issue of course.

I am so freakin' happy to hear that! Thank you for replying... you've made me even more rabid for the release I'm really hoping NoEx (who I realllly want to keep calling NOFX... my god will 90s punk never leave me?!) will go with an open source release or at least be 100% clean with a virustotal scan so that I won't be torn on what I want vs safety.

Oh and as for Rascal @ VPU, yep I'm familiar. I have a massive (if not complete) VP collection, but for whatever reason it has just never felt as satisfying as TPA. Not sure if it's the physics, the visuals, or the irritatingly complex setup and troubleshooting... but something about it just never hooked me as much as TPA has. Still, I have to give VP and FP major props for showing the world that digital recreations have potential (not to mention being great tools to mess around with ideas for new tables).

 

[Robert Misner]

That hybrid view looks amazing. On a 32" inch 4k display i bet it will look incredible.
I'm currently torn between picking up a VirtuPin Mini, experimenting with an ultrawide monitor on a swivel vesa mount, just waiting till some kind of occulus rift version comes out..its overwhelming and confusing which way to go.(wheres a crystal ball when ya need one).
Must say I'm as excited for this mod and the dx11 update as I've been for anything game related in years.

 

[shutyertrap]

But it's been two weeks now and not a single comment on this from FS. Can't say that I'm surprised.... Is it so difficult to express some general thoughts about this?

Maybe no comment, but a few of them have viewed the thread. As for expressing thoughts...they may not be able to when it comes to a mod, especially when they themselves are developing a cab look. I would rather have no expression at all than a cease and desist!

 

[kinggo]

I don't know, I'll rather hear what someone has to say. No matter what they think about this, they can't stop it anyway. Even if it is "illegal" and does mod their code. Here, maybe. But interent is everywhere so this will find a home somwhere else. So why the secrecy?
I respect what FS did for pinball and what they are still doing for us but as we all know TPA isn't perfect on any platform, there are a lot of things that were supposed to be in the game already and some others that are planned, but didn't we have enough of broken promisses? This thread is 2 years old and it seems that cabinet mode was in plans even before. So, after years of waiting someone does something about it and now FS has nothing to say about it??? It's not that there is a hundred options/opinions, in two weeks time they could come from "I don't know, maybe" to yes or no. If they were open enough to kickstart some tables to please the customers why would this be a secret. I know, one brings the money the other might make them lose some, but even if it is so and it is about that (all speculations) why not come clean about it? We are complaining about a lot of other things so one more won't make a difference. And NoEx would probably sleep better.

 

[NoEx]

But it's been two weeks now and not a single comment on this from FS. Can't say that I'm surprised.... Is it so difficult to express some general thoughts about this?

Actually they do care, some of them are currently betatesting my mod.

 

[shutyertrap]

Actually they do care, some of them are currently betatesting my mod.

NoEx gonna get paid! Hehe.

 

[kinggo]

Actually they do care, some of them are currently betatesting my mod.

man, you just spilled the secret of the year. You'll be charged for inside trading or something like that.
Seriously, was it so difficult then to welcome this publicly, in the open?

 

[poposchmatzer]

Since one year after announcement that they working on cab support, I have an unfinished cabinet standing around. I feel ripped off for a long time. They don't answer questions, they don't give information and perhaps all previous purchased seasons packs are obsolete after releasing the cab version. Such ****ty customer support I've rarely experienced. I can only spend money on things that I need and not for things that someday, somehow get released.

 

[Gord Lacey]

I feel for you, poposchmatzer. That's one reason I didn't order an iCade until they were already beta testing the support; I didn't want something sitting around that was going to be part of a feature they hadn't implemented.

 

[NoEx]

man, you just spilled the secret of the year. You'll be charged for inside trading or something like that.
Seriously, was it so difficult then to welcome this publicly, in the open?

It was obviously a joke Radio silence from FS since i've announced it.

 

[SickBoy]

In anticipation for this, and for my plans to make "hybrid" views for all tables that show the backglass so I can get rid of the floating HUD, I went through every single table to see which ones don't have live scores/DMDs/etc. The results are as follows:

Of the 57 currently released tables, a max of 13 will still require the floating HUD as the scores/DMDs are just static textures.

- 5 definitely do not have live displays

(Base) Ripley's Believe It or Not
(Base) Tales of the Arabian Nights
(Base) Theatre of Magic
(Season 1) Bride of Pin-Bot
(Season 1) Funhouse

- 5 *probably* don't have live displays, but I was only able to test using a 4 player game since only a small portion of the backglass is visible without the camera mod (primarily the 3rd and 4th player scores)

(Base) Black Hole
(Season 1) Genie
(Season 1) Gorgar
(Season 2) Firepower
(Season 2) Goin' Nuts

- 3 are completely unknown to be working or not without the mod, though I'm betting on them not being live

(Season 1) Big Shot
(Season 1) Black Knight
(Season 2) Central Park


It's a shame those won't be usable, and hopefully FS will update at least some of them with a live display at some point. But 44/57 (77%) tables being hybrid-able isn't too shabby, and it's only a single button press to get the HUD back anyways!

 

[SickBoy]

Not to double post, but here's some examples of what a hybrid view can look like (disclaimer: I use SweetFX, so... yeah):

Full backglass view (for the most part... kinda half-assed this one as I just used my Who Dunnit presets for it):

Optimized "DMD only and table" view:

It's a tad tricky to get the camera perfect (no fault of the mod), so really it ends up being a matter of taste and what you want to be even/angled. The flipper area sometimes can't really be made perfectly level with the backglass because of how digital perspective works, though tweaks to angle, FOV, etc. can tweak the entire thing to what your preferences are.

For DMD tables this mod is going to be godly for hybrid views since you can chop out most of the backglass if desired. EMs/etc. or tables that have backglass toys will be a tad trickier since you *have* to zoom out to the full backglass, but it's still amazing in my opinion.

I played a decent amount of rounds with these views on several tables so far, and it's incredible. It really changes how the game feels and is totally viable as a floating HUD replacement. It took a little getting used to since I was used to having the DMD/etc. right in my face the whole time, but this is definitely my preferred method of play (at least once I fine tune everything to my tastes). Obviously (as I previously stated) it's not possible to use a live score display for every table, but most work and it's a game changer with the immersion factor for sure!

 

[Jeff Strong]

Love that 2nd one with the DMD. I always wanted that view. It's a bit more natural then directly overhead too.