PS3 Twilight Zone discussion

[Sinistar]

So here's my preview / review of it , Im having the saturation toned down which will hopefully make less color bleed , but for now .

 

[Mark Miwurdz]

I'm loving it. Just got 15 billion. Could score more if I played it real tight. Might have a go at the top score at the weekend.

 

[dtown8532]

Didn't see any mention of it but I really like the TZ custom ball.

 

[brakel]

I've never played this table in the wild. I'm really enjoying it very much. On first play it has some old school traits and I mean that in a good way. As I play it I discover that it has more depth and nuance than any other table I've played on TPA. I always like to play for a few days on a new table before reading any of the instructions or strategy. I still have much more to learn.

 

[Jeff Strong]

Finally got around to playing it, and having fun so far.

Only real complaint besides the bugs is that it's a too bright for me. Can't wait for a dimmer lighting option so we can really enjoy the light show.

 

[Sinistar]

I know , Jeff I feel the same way, they show off the preview version and it's PERFECT , perfect lighting , not too dark , NOT TOO BRIGHT , and the table on PS3 is practically pastel colors , and this time there is no "blue filter" like Harley Davidson, it's just not as cool as that XbOx preview version , it's a peacock when it should be more subtle . Was this another accidental thing when they converted to PS3 , where the table converted wrong? I'd like to hope so ,because that would mean a patch to fix it back the right way.

 

[Jeff Strong]

I know , Jeff I feel the same way, they show off the preview version and it's PERFECT , perfect lighting , not too dark , NOT TOO BRIGHT , and the table on PS3 is practically pastel colors , and this time there is no "blue filter" like Harley Davidson, it's just not as cool as that XbOx preview version , it's a peacock when it should be more subtle . Was this another accidental thing when they converted to PS3 , where the table converted wrong? I'd like to hope so ,because that would mean a patch to fix it back the right way.

Agreed man. It's overly bright and saturated, which really takes away from the light show.

It doesn't have to be quite as dark as the PAPA vid below (although that would be great, IMO), but I realize everyone has their own tastes, so something in the middle would probably be best for now (something along the lines of what they did with BOP) until they can add a lighting slider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYy0aNj9GLU

Video won't embed for some reason, but check it out. The difference in the multiball lighting (4:00 mark) between TPA and that vid is incredible.

 

[Sinistar]

Ok, I keep hoping for photo realistic Pinball tables , and Farsight makes them so "artsy fartsy" , playstation 2 era graphics , and you have to wonder if the tools dev kit they use is for PS3 ? Are these tables the best they can do on a deadline, and they intend to refine them to something more polished? This is TWILIGHTZONE a class A pinball classic , one of the best tables ever , and the release is not the best representation it could be . It's one cool table , but why is it so saturated , why was it set in a bright ambience ?? Why cant I have a light effect that throws out a bright effect like the real table , why do they have such a hard time making transparencies that look real? Red glass or red plastic , it looks the same in a videogame , it looks like a surface that you see through , not opaques , transparent .

does it really tax the Ps3 to reproduce these effects? after seeing games like Metal Gear Rising Revengenace ? Or is that the expensive deluxe developer kit ?
RANT MODE: off

 

[Lord Boron]

I think the thing I don't like is that the tables have an almost defused, fuzzy look. Kind of like a picture taken through a soft focus lense. I would prefer a sharper look like the ios tables, but with obvious graphical and lighting improvements.

 

[Butterkins]

does it really tax the Ps3 to reproduce these effects? after seeing games like Metal Gear Rising Revengenace ?

(Personally, I didn't think much of MGRR. Just more of the same, with ordinary graphics and even more Kojima pretension. It seems more cutscene than actual game, just like MGS.)

Anywaaay... it's a bit unfair to compare shooters/action games with pinball. Pinball does a different set of things, and requires much (all?) of its assets to be in memory and visible at any one time. You can't just LOD away transparent ramps, or reduce the accuracy of the physics when the frame rate dips. And it has to run at 60fps, all the time. It can't do a Farcry 3 and dip down to 15fps, tearing the screen like crazy, every time an explosion goes off.

However, you do have some good points.

1) The biggest problem seems to relate to Farsight's decision to go with 1080p on console. Just my opinion, but I believe this was a bad mistake. Apparently it was due to a "management" decision, and maybe "1080p" looks good on a checklist somewhere.

However, the real world effect of this is that the tables don't look particularly good. In order to get 1080p at 60fps, there have been cutbacks in terms of lighting, texturing, shading and polygon count. There's no glass reflection. And on the smaller devices, we see that shadows are missing entirely. And so the balls appear to float on the table.


In short: TPA looks a bit... basic.

Compare and contrast to Zen's products on console: these run at 720p x 60fps. And despite the lower resolution, they look a lot better. There is a much higher polygon density, there are very few low resolution textures to be found, and the lighting is generally well done.

More than that, though... Zen -- despite what people may think of the physics settings or gameplay choices -- obviously put a hell of a lot of polish in to what they do. Which brings me to...


2) The other big problem: art and design. IMO, Farsight needs the help of a professional designer or team. This help is required across the entire product line, across every product.

Professional design and artistic help is needed with the lighting choices, the background environments, the UI, the logo, the icon, the cabinet textures, you name it.

It's the main area where this product is severely lacking. The polish just isn't there, even if the intention is. Much of the art looks like "programmer art".

 

[brakel]

I agree that TPA lacks graphic realism, but I think Zen is more cartoony looking than TPA.

 

[Sumez]

Ok, I keep hoping for photo realistic Pinball tables , and Farsight makes them so "artsy fartsy" , playstation 2 era graphics , and you have to wonder if the tools dev kit they use is for PS3 ? Are these tables the best they can do on a deadline, and they intend to refine them to something more polished? This is TWILIGHTZONE a class A pinball classic , one of the best tables ever , and the release is not the best representation it could be . It's one cool table , but why is it so saturated , why was it set in a bright ambience ?? Why cant I have a light effect that throws out a bright effect like the real table , why do they have such a hard time making transparencies that look real? Red glass or red plastic , it looks the same in a videogame , it looks like a surface that you see through , not opaques , transparent .

does it really tax the Ps3 to reproduce these effects? after seeing games like Metal Gear Rising Revengenace ? Or is that the expensive deluxe developer kit ?
RANT MODE: off

Not to rain on your parade, but I think you're confusing dev kits with game (or graphics) engines.
Dev kit just allows you to compile your code to the PS3 CPU. Making a pretty game requires good shaders and lots of optimization skills, even with hardware as powerful as the PS3's.


That said, I'd also love to see a more realistic looking pinball game on PS3/X360 than what TPA currently does. I don't think it really requires more "raw power", though I wouldn't mind seeing a "drop" from 1080p to 720p either. I think it's all in the art assets, shaders, and code.

TPA, as a pinball game has a huge advantage when it comes to optimizing the visuals. First of all, most of the objects are static, so there's no animation and transformations to take care of on the playfield, ramps, etc. Also, a pinball table is actually fairly simplistic, even with the toys and stuff, there aren't too many polygons at all, so even if they can't make use of the typical tricks of clipping away stuff that would be hidden by the z-buffer or reducing detail on far away objects, they wouldn't really have to.
With a PS3, it should technically be possible to make amazingly realistic looking pinball tables. They should get in touch with someone who's skilled at making realistic looking static plastic/chrome objects in programs like Maya.

 

[ROTTEN]

I agree that TPA lacks graphic realism, but I think Zen is more cartoony looking than TPA.

It sure is, but it's responsive and it works.

 

[Captain Rumwood]

I got my codes last night. . . . Once I started playing, my anger was appeased. The game, while it has some bugs, is amazing!

I only have one question. How do you access the game credits? I searched for it but couldn't find them. Weren't Kickstarter backers' names supposed to appear on the game credits list?

 

[sixmillion]

The other big problem: art and design.[/B] IMO, Farsight needs the help of a professional designer or team. This help is required across the entire product line, across every product.

Professional design and artistic help is needed with the lighting choices, the background environments, the UI, the logo, the icon, the cabinet textures, you name it.

It's the main area where this product is severely lacking. The polish just isn't there, even if the intention is. Much of the art looks like "programmer art".

Yes , they do need to improve in this area. totally agree.

 

[Tabe]

The bug is 100% reproduceable happening after the end of random games , usually non high scores , hard to pinpoint if it's how fast you hit X to begin that causes it or what it is , but it's very common . Not a gamebreaker , just quirky , always loads your game as PLAYER 2 .

If your description of how to reproduce the bug is "end of random games, usually non high scores, hard to pinpoint"...then the bug is NOT 100% reproducible.

FWIW, I played about 10 games of TZ last night and didn't see this bug once.

Tabe

 

[Tabe]

Whats up with the plunger? pull it half way release nothing.

The plunger is a mess. Pull it back halfway, nothing. Pull it back halfway, it blasts out. The power levels on the plunger and the resulting shots seem to have to relationship to each other.

Tabe

 

[arttq]

Just completed all the remaining wizard goals with a 6.8 billion game. It was very satisfying.

 

[Tabe]

I completed the Gumball Combo three times last night - and the Standard Goal still didn't pop.

Tabe

 

[Lord Boron]

The plunger is a mess. Pull it back halfway, nothing. Pull it back halfway, it blasts out. The power levels on the plunger and the resulting shots seem to have to relationship to each other.

Tabe

You have to make sure the ball is settled. When it first loads the ball can roll a bit into the other lane, making it difficult to shoot, but then it rolls back into position.