Details on PC Cabinet support for TPA

[Robert Misner]

ya I love the TFTC VP9 Physmod5 Night mode table..it could be my favorite table period..Cheeseball horror and humor and fun multi ball awesome ramps..just really enjoy it but I'm a casual player not competitive player at all.
Pinballx letting you setup all your pinball games in one interface frontEnd is amazing to the overall experience
Once i swap my pinball desktop system to an i7quadcore I'm sure Unit3d will play better to.

 

[Jeff Strong]

It's not my intention to 'take sides' in any way or form regarding promises (or not) from FS regarding cab support. However, as many of you know I recently set off on my own cab building journey. Along this journey I crossed many hurdles and only found the answers by asking questions...some of those questions were sent directly to FS, as their answers would or could be the difference as to how I built my cab.

FS never once used the word 'Promise'. However, from the information I was sent...cab support seemed to be on the cards, so to speak, and the info I was given influenced some purchases and also how I designed my cab. This has come at a cost to myself, and it could be a cost I may never get back. For example...

I was told by FS that there could be a 3rd monitor, but not at release. At release it might just be Dmd.

I was told the backglass would change with each game.

I was also told it would support the virtual plunger.

A few weeks later, when asked about progress, I was informed that that they were nearly there with cab support, but not quite...and keep an eye on FB for announcements.

I believed that cab support was close to being released, especially as I had received 'promising' news about progress, so to ensure I was ready for it, I made a few purchases. I bought the Dmd and the virtual plunger, as FS had assured me they were incorporating those into cab support. At that time I had no reason to think cab support wasn't going to happen so I not only paid for those items, I also incurred shipping costs, and highest of all, custom charges!

As a result, I must be £300 to £400 out of pocket. Yes, I could have waited for cab support to be officially released, but when a respectable company sends you emails informing you that things are almost ready, you take it as read. £400 is a lot of money, but would have been the icing on the cake as far as a fully built cab goes. Now I just have a Dmd sat in a box gathering dust. And I know some will say I can used it for VP, but I'm not great at setting up all that software...it looks over complicated...but I only purchased the Dmd because FS sent me an email saying CS would incorporate a Dmd and CS was pretty close to being finished.

I posted this on here because I'm seeing arguments about wether or not FS made promises regarding CS etc, and I see the arguments heating up. As far as I know, FS never promised anything, at least they never used the words 'we promise', but FS did give the impression it was on its way and was being developed and close to release, which for many, is as good as a promise. And some, like myself, believed in FS so much that we were prepared to invest in this, either by purchasing seasons of TPA when otherwise we may not have, contributing to kickstarters or simply purchasing Dmds, 3rd monitors, plungers etc.

For reasons stated above, I'm really disappointed that FS have put all this on hold, because TPA was partly the reason I built my cab. Yes, it's still playable and much more enjoyable than when I played it on my iPad, but CS would be the ultimate way to play. I can certainly understand everyone else's frustration, especially if they too have invested as I have. Perhaps it is to do with a Stern deal, I don't know. But playing the virtual game has made myself and many friends want to go out and play...even purchase a real Pin. So I think if it is to do with Stern, they are perhaps not understanding how folk work.

But the bottom line is this...I've experienced disappointments throughout life...and this just adds to that list. But as members of the same forum, it's not worth arguing with each other about. We're all here because of our interest in TPA as well as all things pinball. TPA is a great game, with or without CS and I believe it's the best out there, with better things to come. If ur annoyed with FS, don't leave...email your concerns to FS and let them know how you feel. Whilst this forum is a good way to vent your frustration it may never get heard by FS, so let them know your thoughts by email etc. You never know, if enough people contact them, perhaps it may have positive effects. If I knew how to start an online petition...I would. Perhaps that's something worth doing...

In the meantime, it seems FS are aware of Noex and his talents and haven't intervened in any way, so this is a good sign. If Robert and Noex are able to bridge the gap with their ideas then at least we are a step closer to CS, and perhaps we should get behind these guys where possible. But please guys...don't ever promise anything...you'll never hear the last of it! Ha ha.

Good post.

 

[Robert Misner]

Wasn't satisfied with the logo picture so I'm trying something else Here's what I came up with.
http://1drv.ms/1L6aSoU

here's preview

 

[SilverBalls]

Very nicely summed up L33. I just want to add a few final points.

I would disagree what some people say that cabinets are 'niche'. Yes maybe it is true that full 'Virtual Cabs' are Niche - the number is probably in the low 1000s.
However there are many people can play 'cabinet style' at their desk. Rotating monitors on stands or wall-mounted brackets are common-place nowadays. Second monitors on desks
are also quite common. There must hundreds of thousands of people who have the equipment to play 'cabinet style' with 2 screens.

The kind of people that build cabinets and publish threads on their cabinets create a lot of publicity for the software they use, and I am sure this would generate a lot of sales.
Keeping people like this happy makes sense - The cab crowd are good promoters. Just look at the Cyperpin2001 videos on Youtube showing cabinet play in Pinball FX2 and TPA. One has over 10K views.

Farsight may not have promised cabinet play, but I remember before TPA was even released, when asked whether they would eventually support cabinets the answer was always we hope to one day. I remember when they were desparately trying to get 1000 likes on facebook at one point - in those days they needed all the support they could get. Over the years they have been asked multiple times about cab play and they have said it is being worked on. They have even said they won't charge for it, once it is released. They have demoed it and published videos of their cab play on faceebook. They have mentioned it in newsletters and told people they bought a Virtuapin to build the cab support for. There must be many people who bought a Virtuapin or built a cabinet off this information.

At the end of the day pinball gameplay is comprised of two 'playboards' for want of a better word... The Playfield and The Backglass/DMD. As so many people have 2 screens why not support two screen play? It is a pinball simulation at the end of the day, is it asking too much?

 

[SilverBalls]

Wasn't satisfied with the logo picture so I'm trying something else Here's what I came up with.
http://1drv.ms/1L6aSoU

here's preview

The other one was good, but the second looks a lot slicker Robert .

I tried a quick test last night to make the game span two screens, but didn't have much luck.

* My playfield is 1920x1080 and then rotated to portrait.
* I made my backglass 1600*1200 as well (natively it can go up to 1920x1080).
* I extend the display across monitors (ie: not clone)
* I arranged the two screens in the NVidia panel like you showed in a T-format making the playfield the primary monitor.
* I set the TPA backbuffer under the DX11 settings to 1080 x 2160, and tell it to run Windowed
* I didn't use the Camera Mod at this stage for this step.

Now when I drag the game window to span 2 screens I cannot get the DMD to just show on the backglass. Both monitors show some parts of the TPA playfield the same, and as I resize the
window it is like the game is moving within the window. Hard to explain, so here is a picture.
EDIT: After resizing the window a lot more, I realised it is always forcing the whole game screen to be on the playfield monitor, so the top of the PF monitor always shows the top of the TPA game. The more I drag the game to the backglass, the more of the game shows on the backglass. I searched for some kind of 'Autosnap' settings in windows 7 and disabled these in the registry, but it made no difference. I changed HKEY_CURRENT_USER \Control Panel\Desktop settings to zero for WindowArrangementActive, SnapSizing.

I tried switching Aero on and off, in case that makes a difference but it didn't. I must be doing something stupid.
Any help appreciated!

 

[chinzman93]

Very nicely summed up L33. I just want to add a few final points.

I would disagree what some people say that cabinets are 'niche'. Yes maybe it is true that full 'Virtual Cabs' are Niche - the number is probably in the low 1000s.
However there are many people can play 'cabinet style' at their desk. Rotating monitors on stands or wall-mounted brackets are common-place nowadays. Second monitors on desks
are also quite common. There must hundreds of thousands of people who have the equipment to play 'cabinet style' with 2 screens.

The kind of people that build cabinets and publish threads on their cabinets create a lot of publicity for the software they use, and I am sure this would generate a lot of sales.
Keeping people like this happy makes sense - The cab crowd are good promoters. Just look at the Cyperpin2001 videos on Youtube showing cabinet play in Pinball FX2 and TPA. One has over 10K views.

Farsight may not have promised cabinet play, but I remember before TPA was even released, when asked whether they would eventually support cabinets the answer was always we hope to one day. I remember when they were desparately trying to get 1000 likes on facebook at one point - in those days they needed all the support they could get. Over the years they have been asked multiple times about cab play and they have said it is being worked on. They have even said they won't charge for it, once it is released. They have demoed it and published videos of their cab play on faceebook. They have mentioned it in newsletters and told people they bought a Virtuapin to build the cab support for. There must be many people who bought a Virtuapin or built a cabinet off this information.

At the end of the day pinball gameplay is comprised of two 'playboards' for want of a better word... The Playfield and The Backglass/DMD. As so many people have 2 screens why not support two screen play? It is a pinball simulation at the end of the day, is it asking too much?

Well said....totally agree with your comments.

 

[Robert Misner]

edit: you did that sorry hmmm
I've only run tpa on my desktop with windows 8 and windows 10 so i'm not sure thats an issue
here are my nvidia game settings for tpadx11

not sure that will make a difference but worth checking

and tpa settings(tho i got resolution 2x these now for supersampling

as well run the camera mod first stops the window from snapping to the first monitors screen edge so you can drag around easier and it remembers were it was as long as camera mod is running

 

[SilverBalls]

Thanks Robert for the screengrabs. I changed all my nVidia settings to match your but unfortunately no luck - but worth a try. I also run the CamMod just in case, but still get the same issue.

I took another screenshot which shows, I can move the TPA window up to the top of the backglass as much as I want and the window moves fine with no re-positioning, however the game running in the window still snaps to the top of the first playfield so I end up with two monitors showing some parts of the game twice:

If I try and move a normal window around to span 2 screens it works fine.
Maybe NoEx has an idea - will be interesting to know if NoEx is using Windows 7, or if anyone else with Windows 7 gets this issue.

 

[SilverBalls]

Fixed it! I upgraded my nVidia drivers to 355.82 and it works. I was going to try that last night, but because the drivers I had were only about a year old I didn't bother. Lesson learned

 

[Robert Misner]

have you downloaded the latest nvidia drivers?
i'm on 353.54

 

[Robert Misner]

ha just as i was typing that you responded

 

[Mike Reitmeyer]

I've been pretty swamped lately here, so I haven't been reading on the forums much. I skimmed through the past few pages on this thread to see what was going on.

Just wanted to clarify that indefinitely does not mean "never" it means there is no defined date or timeline.

That said, I don't have any new information. I'll pass along some of the frustrations here to management.

 

[Jeff Strong]

I've been pretty swamped lately here, so I haven't been reading on the forums much. I skimmed through the past few pages on this thread to see what was going on.

Just wanted to clarify that indefinitely does not mean "never" it means there is no defined date or timeline.

That said, I don't have any new information. I'll pass along some of the frustrations here to management.

Appreciated as always, Mike. I know it goes without saying, but the frustrations are directed at the management and not you.

 

[chinzman93]

Appreciated as always, Mike. I know it goes without saying, but the frustrations are directed at the management and not you.

Yes agreed....We appreciate your work and passing along our frustrations to management. Thanks!

 

[poposchmatzer]

Yes No that's too much, I lose my mind

 

[mpad]

Thanks for the reply Mike.
never understood it as a final nail in the coffin.
Only that it's not gonna happen very soon and we don't have to check every day for it and continue with our lives until business matters resolve themselves.

How old is Gary Stern?

 

[SilverBalls]

have you downloaded the latest nvidia drivers?
i'm on 353.54

Thanks again Robert - you solved it in parallel

It worked quite well however I experienced tearing on the play field - typical vsync type issues. I know I had that issue with Unity3d which similarly spans 2 screens in Fake Full screen mode and I solved it by enabling Aero. That didn't seem to help last night however I was running out of time, so when I return tonight I will recheck as I might have messed with too many settings. Luckily I have screenshots of all the old settings. Cheers.

Good news that Mike will alert the management. Cheers Mike.

 

[Robert Misner]

Silverballs make sure both monitors are the same timing that might cause tearing
I think you will want aero back on and maybe vsync for the game options under nvidia controls


I've updated my camera files for the mod yet again..I wasn't happy seeing the Lockbar on every table so i've adjusted the layback tilt less so things fill the screen better. These all default to the cab view and are optimized for the stretched between 2 monitors mode,the other two views need adjusting but I'm not sure what do do with them for now.

Heres link to camera files
http://1drv.ms/1iExH87

and heres composite shot showing 3 tables views and their backglass's on second monitor
I think thats pretty close to optimal for what i can adjust.

 

[mpad]

Freakin awesome!

 

[L33]

@RM...Looks good...look forward to trying it soon. Makes me want to make another backbox, just for playing TPA.