Android - Bug Observed Bugs in Twilight Zone (v1.7.0 BETA)

[Ryan Routon]

I am looking into the framerate issues with the custom balls, let me give you a bit of technical background on how these are handled. For the regular ball (non-custom) the ball should not appear to rotate, and look just as it did previously. When the custom ball is switched on balls become much more expensive (relatively) than the old way for these reasons. 1) Custom balls are being drawn twice, once for the custom texture, and twice for the transparent outer shell that represents the reflection. 2) the alpha blend between the outer and inner shell can be costly on older devices at the edge of their performance. You were seeing the "ghost" ball because when you home out our app loses the openGL context and the opaque flag wasn't getting set back up again.

We played with other ways around this but currently this is the solution that we have come up with. Why you are seeing slowdown without custom on I am not sure, I will have to take a look.

The Scared stiff ending will be fixed and I will take another crack at BS, not sure why portrait got messed up like that =\

Still catching up from the holidays and personal stuff ( I hate insurance companies ) but hopefully I will have something to you guys soon.

 

[Ryan Routon]

Not sure what you mean here, are you saying the default texture in the second beta looks different from the ball in the first?

If the grey flat texture is the old ball, is there any way you can add the flat texture of the newer ball as a selectable texture as well?

 

[Pop Sergeant]

... For the regular ball (non-custom) the ball should not appear to rotate, and look just as it did previously. When the custom ball is switched on balls become much more expensive (relatively) than the old way for these reasons. 1) Custom balls are being drawn twice, once for the custom texture, and twice for the transparent outer shell that represents the reflection. 2) the alpha blend between the outer and inner shell can be costly on older devices at the edge of their performance. You were seeing the "ghost" ball because when you home out our app loses the openGL context and the opaque flag wasn't getting set back up again ...

Could it be then, that when we select the gray patch in EXTRAs we are not getting the default (non-custom) ball but a gray/silver version of a custom ball that is being drawn twice?

I ask because (1) the silver ball does not seem to be the same visually after visiting the Extras dialog, which is also what I think PINWIZ was trying to convey (2) the transparency issue is happening with the default (non-custom) ball too which should only have the outer shell if I read you right so when that shell is lost ... ghost ball, because there is no inner texture?

Just thinking out loud.

 

[Ryan Routon]

definitely possible, I just ported the code over so I will have to look at it to see if something is being lost in translation (or its happening on ios too). So you are saying, fresh install, go into a table look at ball, exit, go to extras, don't change anything, eject ball and it looks different? I just gave that a try and I can't see a difference.

 

[PiN WiZ]

definitely possible, I just ported the code over so I will have to look at it to see if something is being lost in translation (or its happening on ios too). So you are saying, fresh install, go into a table look at ball, exit, go to extras, don't change anything, eject ball and it looks different? I just gave that a try and I can't see a difference.

The default ball is a lighter shade of grey (almost like the PHOF ball) on the 2nd beta build. I reinstalled the first beta and the default ball is darker and looks like it's supposed to.

 

[Pop Sergeant]

Yes, I think 2 or 3 out of 4 of us who have addressed it are saying exactly that and also that we see a difference from beta(1) and beta(2) in the default ball from the start.

In the case of Jared and I, we also (on TZ) have seen the PB go from a lighter shade of gray to a darker shade more closely matched to the default gray color after changing skins and then going back to the default. I've posted captures of that somewhere in this thread.

I'll agree it (steel ball texture) is a subtle difference but it is different.

Some of us have been speculating it is a hardware processing point that makes it different for some devices but not all. But going back to your earlier comment about the technicalities would it make sense that if is is being handled as a custom ball as you described that the lighter shade could be a result of there being no inner texture when the processing expects one?

I know you just got back in and we inundated this thread but there are several discussions among 3 or 4 different users and devices discussing the issue at length.

By the way ... in case all the "issues"seem disheartening ... one,welcome back and two, game play on TZ is beau coup - great effort!

 

[Nik Barbour]

Yes (in summary) - beta ver01, ball is darker, and is my preference for the default steel colour.

Beta ver02 lighter colour silver, that suffers transparency, and has performance slow down on my older device.

Hope you enjoyed Thanksgiving Ryan - welcome back!
Pop Sergeant summed it up, but awesome job with TZ.

 

[jaredmorgs]

The way they designed it (they may have to change it) the gray flat texture is the old ball. I have found the transparent ball issue and fixed that. Can you reproduce the slow down on other tables?

I have only seen the slowdown on TZ, Ryan. Doing the pause>resume trick resets the thread priority as per usual. This is akin to the taxi slowdown with HUD issue in previous releases.

I often see it after exiting the power field.

Has anyone else observed regular slowdown on other tables?

 

[jaredmorgs]

And yes. Monumental effort getting this table as good as you have, Ryan.

Everyone in the different development arms must have been dreading the day this table went out to public testing. ;-)

TZ is a very high prestige table, and has a legion of "train-spotter obsessive" fans just ready to pick holes in the smallest of slightly incorrect detail. Everyone on this thread, including me, probably falls into this category.

We're here to serve... and observe.

Hope the break was rejuvenating, Ryan. You certainly deserved it!

 

[Nik Barbour]

I have only seen the slowdown on TZ, Ryan. Doing the pause>resume trick resets the thread priority as per usual. This is akin to the taxi slowdown with HUD issue in previous releases.

I often see it after exiting the power field.

Has anyone else observed regular slowdown on other tables?

I've only really played TZ since getting the beta - but did have ball invisibility during one game of big shot. (table doesn't require ball skins).
This leads me to think it must be present in all tables to differing degrees depending on speed of play and complexity, and felt more depending on device performance. (however - I am quite often wrong as my wife points out).

 

[Carl Spiby]

I want my shiny balls back

 

[xAzatothx]

What a noob! I only just discovered the 4th flipper Couple of more issues.

1) I just had a game where there was a constant clicking noise and the table would not zoom out for the plunger. I got to a skill shot and couldn't see the plunger. Remained for all 3 balls, but was fine on next game.
2) Just tried playing for first time using headphones on my nexus 7. Gophers sounds really good, but TZ sounds quite poor. Explosions are loud, but music is quiet and sounds like poor sample rate? I don't get the same impact and vibrancy as say Gophers.
3) Ball transparency issue is a problem on all tables, I get it every time on the free play Gophers table, every time the advert pops up it causes the transparency issue.
4) I've not experienced any slow down playing Gophers yet.

 

[Sean DonCarlos]

What a noob! I only just discovered the 4th flipper

How did you shoot the piano to start door panels then?

2) Just tried playing for first time using headphones on my nexus 7. Gophers sounds really good, but TZ sounds quite poor. Explosions are loud, but music is quiet and sounds like poor sample rate? I don't get the same impact and vibrancy as say Gophers.

TZ's main music (Golden Earring's "Twilight Zone") is not particularly loud at most times - if anything else at all is going on it becomes inaudible - and doesn't sound particularly good even on the real table. TZ was supposed to be the first game with the DCS sound system, but DCS wasn't ready in time for production and they had to cram all the sound on the older Yamaha board, so it's quite possible the sample rate is low in an effort to conserve space.

 

[xAzatothx]

thanks for headsup Sean. Ref piano, I very nearly posted a question asking how the **** you are meant to hit it Glad I didn't now. I'd obviously been hitting it by accident with some flipper spamming. In my defense that 4th flipper does look very small on my device - god knows how you see it on a little phone.

 

[Nik Barbour]

thanks for headsup Sean. Ref piano, I very nearly posted a question asking how the **** you are meant to hit it Glad I didn't now. I'd obviously been hitting it by accident with some flipper spamming. In my defense that 4th flipper does look very small on my device - god knows how you see it on a little phone.

Don't forget - when shooting the camera using the upper rh flipper, to lift and hold the upper left flipper up, as it partially obscures the shot.
Might have been blocking your shots if you didn't know it was there!

 

[Carl Spiby]

Here's some high res TZ for you all to pick fault with

http://db.tt/H25fvqHg

 

[Kolchak357]

Glass on gumball machine looks too clear. (Unlike the glass on NGG)

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

How do they achieve transparency like that then muddle the rest?

 

[Ryan Routon]

I am not seeing the difference, can someone provide a screen shot of both default balls? I just confirmed with the programmer that did this bit of code and we have not touched the rgb values at all, we just added an alpha channel.

 

[Nik Barbour]

I am not seeing the difference, can someone provide a screen shot of both default balls? I just confirmed with the programmer that did this bit of code and we have not touched the rgb values at all, we just added an alpha channel.

Ver01 beta (darker ball)

Ver02 beta (lighter ball)