Too easy tables (PC version)

[Sean DonCarlos]

citation needed

Twilight Zone leaderboards approximately one month after TZ's release on iOS.

 

[SilverBalls]

RetroDude well said, not everyone is a superhero !!! it takes all types to make the world go round. JenniferS don`t take these fellas too seriously,you know what some are like !!!!

I am not a good player at all and my games are relatively short I am sure in comparison to others in these forums, however when I say that I want more difficult settings this for me (as I have mentioned before) is more related to the slope of the table and the strength of the flippers. It is the feel of a real pin that I desire more than anything else - even if my scores go down as long as it feels that the tables play like real that is all I want. Now it may well be that where I live whenever I am lucky enough to locate a real pin, it might be that the operator has set the table at a unrealistic slope or the flippers are weak due to wear and tear, but this is certainly typical for me and probably for others.

I think the Farsight physics are great - this has come particularly apparent after playing the PC portrait version in a cabinet, but the flippers are way too powerful - I don't feel like it is a struggle to get the ball up to the top of the table. When I play a real pin my fingers ache from pushing the buttons extra hard to make the ball go faster / higher up the playfields (yes I know a harder push makes no difference).

I didn't quite follow about the meshes and the technical constraints - does anyone know if a simple slope / flipper strength change without changing any other table settings will make the table play tougher and still realistic? If only we could play with some sort of csv/xml file settings to see.

My 12 year old son who has played a lot of VP tables in the cabinet, whilst playing PA for the first time in the cab and without any comments from me, said it feels good but 'it needs more slope'.

 

[RetroDude]

Twilight Zone leaderboards approximately one month after TZ's release on iOS.

How exactly did you determine the relationship between the FarSight leader boards and the people participating in the forums to come up with your 90% figure?

 

[superballs]

I would venture to guess that a lot of the top 100 were members of this forum.
Who know, who cares and why cite anything?

In conclusion...this:

 

[RetroDude]

I would venture to guess that a lot of the top 100 were members of this forum.
Who know, who cares and why cite anything?

The difference is that you say you are guessing.

Opinion and guessing is fine, but attempting to state such as fact isn't, at least by most common forum standards. Using such information as a basis, in full or in part to support ones position in a discussion only serves to weaken and discredit the remaking portions of the position.

I'm not trying to pick on anyone here, but there are an awful lot of numbers and percentages thrown around in these forums that have zero basis in reality. There may be others in this thread. Certainly lots more in other threads. There have been some such claims that have resulted eventually in threads being locked by the forum moderators.

When someone states something as fact and not a guess or opinion, they ought to be able to back up their claims. That's really not asking much, in my personal opinion.

I hadn't noticed at the time that the person I responded to was a forum moderator. In my personal opinion, that makes it a bit worse.

In my professional career, if I make a statement that cites a number or percentage, I have to be able to provide the sources and methodology used to arrive with the number.

I don't wish to argue with anyone here, let alone moderators, but it is what it is and I stand with my statements. I'd still like to know how the 90% figure was arrived at. Totally regardless of what the number means to the rest of the discussion.

Your mileage may vary.

Thanks!

 

[wolfson]

RetroDude here are some figures from the first line of this forum. black hole,4,700,00 on my first attempt, table too easy !!!! well I looked up 2 leaderboards.xbox 360 only 90 people out of 30,752 got more than 4,700,00. on the pc 199 out of 16,932 got more than 4,700,00 interesting %.on xbox about .3 % on pc about 1.25%

 

[norbert26]

the defaults are fine please let me set it harder if i so choose . also people are using different hardware a faster CPU will make it go faster while a slower CPU will slow it down. Add / factor in some are using controllers and some are using the keyboard and we have a big mix or everyone is not on the same playing field. This was also an issue with slower android tablets VS the higher end iPads / other tablets. put settings in game set up to adjust pitch and the like.

 

[Filip]

I agree the table are way too easy in general that you can play with your feet without any problem if you have to use your hands for something else...

 

[Sean DonCarlos]

When someone states something as fact and not a guess or opinion, they ought to be able to back up their claims....I'd still like to know how the 90% figure was arrived at.

That figure came from observing the first 5000 scores on the Twilight Zone leaderboard shortly after its release on iOS, and noting the position of known forum members. In fact, the figure may be higher, since not everyone here uses the same or a similar name for their FarSight login.

I'd like to know what the average scores are for each table. I'm guessing most of you are in the top 5% of TPA players. I don't think it's is too easy for the majority of players. There is no arguing about the ease compared to the real tables. Which I guess is the point you are all making. Would be nice if there was a setting option to keep the better players from getting bored.

Statistics for Twilight Zone:

Scores:
High score: 13.042B
10th score: 7.068B
25th score: 5.516B
50th score: 4.273B
100th score: 3.189B
250th score: 2.171B
500th score: 1.597B
1,000th score: 881M
2,500th score: 375M
5,000th score: 87M

Percentiles:
25th: 460M
50th: 822M
75th: 1.340B
90th: 1.957B
95th: 2.399B
99th: 3.383B

And yes, there are a lot of familiar names in the top 500.

 

[Heretic]

i kinda find this new eleitist debate annoying.

some of our members are surely more fanatical than others.

and while im one of the longer serving members here, im far from good, average at best.

ive never found ive been shunned or mocked for my skills level.

i suggest if the more popular hardcore threads arent to your taste, perhaphs create a more casual thread yourself?

were all players and i refuse to make a distinction from our best loud mouth player to relatively quiet non posters.

i guess what im saying is if you want more casual disscuion get on it and make some!

there will always be hardcore and casual players

cant we all just geta long! *weeps*

farsght will not change the base difficulty level for the many reasons stated so i dont see why anyones overally worried

 

[Fungi]

Yes, I agree with Heretic. He is average at best.

 

[Bonzo]

...but his typing has vastly improved. ;P

No, seriously. I couldn't agree more, h.

 

[netizen]

Yes, I agree with Heretic. He is average at best.

...but his typing has vastly improved. ;P

 

[Jeff Strong]

He even edited his post to correct the typos. Did someone hijack his account?

Seriously though, great post, dude.

 

[norbert26]

I agree the table are way too easy in general that you can play with your feet without any problem if you have to use your hands for something else...

that won't work too well here. i clean bloatware out and unneeded background processes are shut down / disabled. You better be on your feet cause the ball is flying around at 90 miles an hour or it will be down the middle before you can blink an eye.

 

[shutyertrap]

4 pages in and I just saw this thread!

FarSight has a pretty well established look and feel to their tables. This is by design. They want people to feel like they can rock at pinball. There have been a few comments here of people really appreciating that.

Myself, I like to be challenged. That is why I would like difficulty levels. When I used to play Rock Band (shed a tear) I'd start out on medium, quickly get up to speed and then do hard level. Sometimes I'd do expert, depending on the song, and that was great for a challenge. Truth be told though, I didn't find that level of difficulty fun, so I'd alternate between them. I think it'd be great to have that choice in TPA. To have ramps be more like T2 than Creature, to have vicious outlanes, or flippers that weren't super powered.

Regarding the flippers, just remember that FarSight bases gameplay off the tables they own. If they have a brand new coil on a newly rebuilt flipper, it's gonna hit and hit hard. Conversely, they've had flippers that were fairly dead and so they programmed to how they believed it should behave. It's a fine line they have to walk, but as someone who loathes weak flippers, I appreciate it greatly!

 

[debuggiest]

I don't find the PC tables any different than the android tables... maybe you're all going nuts.

 

[RetroDude]

That figure came from observing the first 5000 scores on the Twilight Zone leaderboard shortly after its release on iOS, and noting the position of known forum members. In fact, the figure may be higher, since not everyone here uses the same or a similar name for their FarSight login.

All that means is that you recognize some forum members as having some very high scores for that game.

In no way does identifying certain members translate into any sort of average for forum members or non forum members. Certainly with no way to come up with any sort of percentage.

If you had said that you've identified some forum members among the hugest recorded scores in the leader boards, that would be both accurate and indisputable.

The 90% figure has no basis in anything but pure guesswork. Perhaps the number IS accurate. Perhaps not. Without the ability to track the rankings of every forum member, there is zero chance at any sort of fact based conclusion being made.


The forum stats currently show:
Members 3,545 Active Members 824

Without identifying either all 3,545 or even the 824 members in the leader boards, your numbers are not much better than a guess fitting into a pre-conceived answer based on anecdotes and partial data.

Heck, you even admit that you don't know all of the members' names on the leader boards.
Those other members could lower your numbers just as easily as raise them.

My pure speculation is that many forum members that are NOT anywhere near the top of the leader boards don't post their scores here and tend to be lurkers and readers rather than the most frequent posters. That alone could trash any attempts to divine any sorts of forum user average scores.

Heck, my current Twilight Zone ranking on the iOS leader board is 10,706.
My overall Hall Of Fame ranking is 2,126.

My numbers are better than a lot of people and worse than a lot of people.
They are both considerably lower than some of the folks here in the forums.
I would guess (note that I'm saying that it's only a guess and not attempting to state it as any sort of fact) that my rankings are better than some folks who are forum members.



Once again, I don't want an argument, just that speculation not be pushed as fact. Unverifiable and unbacked "statistics" are worthless and don't serve any valid purpose when trying to debate or discuss any issue.

 

[Jeff Strong]

I fail to see why any of that even matters in light of the original topic. The point of this thread really has nothing to do with the high scores or even the skill level of the forum members or anyone for that matter. As has already been pointed out several times here and in many other threads, you don't have to be a great of a player to want a more challenging option. In any event, the good news is Farsight has plans to add such an option, at least to some degree.

 

[joseph5185]

I think honestly "too easy" is subjective and a matter of opinion as it related to the OP.

I find some tables "easy" that aren't listed as such.

Does anyone agree with me?